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The EDSG Files # 2: Fairey Barracuda 1/72


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7 hours ago, TheBaron said:

The Barracuda didn't have hydraulics Sean. It was articulated by faith alone.:D

 

T, your in luck mate, it's Christmas, how much more faith do you need?...:pray::pray::pray:

 

Inspired thinking, not so much using your head, but what's on it!!

 

Sean

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4 hours ago, perdu said:

The next few days.....

 

with the family.....

 

Oh boy, why on earth ( of in our friend's case Mars) didya have to go and remind me

Hmmm. When you say it out loud like that, it doesn't sound quite as alluring does it?:huh: 

4 hours ago, perdu said:

The collecting specs syndrome has infected me too

 

Hundreds of those little screws and washery bits from my old Pound Shop Reader's glasses

 

Using the hinge off properjob specs is the Mark Of True Genius

 

I'd be kowtowing to you in homage, except for me old bended back and busted knees which obviously makes getting up hard

Gorsh Bill. I don't know what too say.:blush: Thanks and Aw shucks!

 

Never throw a pair out (as the sheep-neuterer said to the bishop)! You never know  what they might come in handy for. I cleaned out the wing-root and did a brief dry-fit to let you see the idea more 'in the round' as it were. A little formula 560 and tape to tack it temporarily inside the outer wing at approximately the right depth-placement:

30965565004_3b323494db_c.jpg

The mounting plateto go in the wing root itself serendipitously could have been moulded for the job to begin with and tucks in nicely:

31806251515_5b4652cbd7_c.jpg

From the underneath aspect you can see where the fuselage needs about 1 - 1.5mm of a cavity bored out to let the mounting to sit in flush within the root, partly for aesthetics and a secure bond, and partly of course so that the hinge is up right against the fuselage so that the wing can close without a gap when at the 'flight-ready' position:

30965566394_ecbee64b93_c.jpg

You get the general idea:

31689889011_ac64e4611c_c.jpg

 

There won't be any more tonight chaps: the car's due back from the garage (jammed brake caliper needed replacing!) and then Famille Baron is off to Rogue One.

 

Bon soir mes modellistes!

 

:pilot: Tony

 

 

 

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14 minutes ago, sean said:

Inspired thinking, not so much using your head, but what's on it!!

Cheers Sean! Right in front of me nose indeed...:lol:

4 minutes ago, CedB said:

Genius. Turned a great model into a real spectacle. Aha ha ha. 

Ced, you're a gem. :rofl:

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22 hours ago, TheBaron said:

11 grams, including the Milliput fuel tank. (I haven't lost the plot - the nose fairing is in there to make up weight for the undercarriage...). Add another couple of grams for detailing plastic and paint and about a 13g loading on the hinge.

 

Wot about the paint - did you take that into account ?

dammit you did (must read thread more closely)

 

my belated apologies - I have been following this thread and just realized that I have never commented upon it. How rude of me.

 

I love work like this.  Pushing the boundaries of modelling, skill, fire-raising, ingenuity, and sanity all in one go. What could be better ?   I have no doubts you will make a success of this.

As to your wing-fold solution - it's turning into a sheer spectacle !

 

 

 

 

 

(okay Martian... your turn...)

Edited by hendie
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Luvvly 'inges there Tony. And I have to re-emphasise our point - never ever throw anything away...okay I make a few exceptions for sanitary reasons obviously. but all old wot nots and bits and bobs....keep em!

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4 hours ago, hendie said:

 

.

As to your wing-fold solution - it's turning into a sheer spectacle !

 

(okay Martian... your turn...)

Can someone please try and get Hendie's "joke" book off of him please? He's turning into comedy's answer to Vogon poetry!

 

Will that do Hendie?

 

Martian

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11 hours ago, TheBaron said:

That shiny-vinyl-like plastic frame material surrounding the metal core emits fine clouds of smoky particles...

 

If you could catch & bottle them you could send them to Ced to use behind his shot down Mig....:)

 

That hinge is just brill Tony!

 

Keith

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17 hours ago, hendie said:

my belated apologies - I have been following this thread and just realized that I have never commented upon it. How rude of me.

 

I love work like this.  Pushing the boundaries of modelling, skill, fire-raising, ingenuity, and sanity all in one go. What could be better ?   I have no doubts you will make a success of this.

As to your wing-fold solution - it's turning into a sheer spectacle !

Thanks for your kind words Hendie! No apologies necessary old top - it's not as if I haven't spent weeks at a time just watching over your shoulder at work upon the Lysander, without me having anything more significant to add than repetitions of 'Wow!':)

17 hours ago, Tomoshenko said:

Luvvly 'inges there Tony. And I have to re-emphasise our point - never ever throw anything away...okay I make a few exceptions for sanitary reasons obviously. but all old wot nots and bits and bobs....keep em!

Quite right Tomo!...though I hope not to turn into one of those sad hoarders you sometimes see in the papers who only have narrow corridors left in their homes, like an odd species of urban consumerist rabbit in their warren.:rolleyes: (said the man who still has a pot of grease on the go that I bought for a mountain bike in 1993...)

13 hours ago, Martian Hale said:

Can someone please try and get Hendie's "joke" book off of him please? He's turning into comedy's answer to Vogon poetry!

Careful dear Martian scribe, you'll catch it across the gobberwarts if he reads that! :analintruder:

11 hours ago, keefr22 said:

 

If you could catch & bottle them you could send them to Ced to use behind his shot down Mig....:)

 

That hinge is just brill Tony!

Cheers Keith old bean. What the Cedster needs is an e-cig on a timer methinks! With a hint of burnt metal and aviation fuel it could even be made to smell authentic as well?

 

E-Cigarette-Electronic_Cigarette-E-Cigs-

Off work today for the holidays, just in time for Storm Babs to make getting the winter fuel in a joyless dash back and forth to to the woodshed with a wet neck: just the thing to wake you up first thing. Having watched that episode of Band of Bothers a couple of nights back though, where Easy Co. are dug into the winter forest at Bastogne, what the hell am I complaining about? I'm just part of that cossetted post-war generation that mewls on Twitfacebooker if it hasn't a suffciently large range of coffees to choose from. Meanwhile in Aleppo...

 

Ah. Spleen vented. World rolls on.

 

For obvious festive reasons I'm just posting this as an announcement that I won't be around much over the next fews days. I hope amidst everything else to get some bench time in and move forwards with the hinge and outer wing, but probably won't get round to posting much. I'll take the obligatory pics however and do a mega-update in a few days.

 

I just want to take this opportunity to thank you guys for your encouragement; I just checked and was astonished to see that this build started in late October, and here we are 25 pages in and only a bit of a wing on. Even so I'm enjoying the pace. and hope you have too.

 

Have a great Christmas all of you - I hope you get all the kits presents you've been hoping for, and I'll speak with you in a few days.

:thumbsup::thumbsup2::bleh::bye: Tony

 

 

 

 

 

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42 minutes ago, TheBaron said:

Careful dear Martian scribe, you'll catch it across the gobberwarts if he reads that! :analintruder:

Then I shall rend him with my burglecruncheon; see if I don't!

 

Martian

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1 hour ago, TheBaron said:

Quite right Tomo!...though I hope not to turn into one of those sad hoarders you sometimes see in the papers who only have narrow corridors left in their homes, like an odd species of urban consumerist rabbit in their warren.:rolleyes: (said the man who still has a pot of grease on the go that I bought for a mountain bike in 1993...)

 

That is a frighteningly accurate desiption of me, at least before we moved and I was forced to heave stuff. I was going to hsve another cull when the shipping container was broached, but in the end the pile of stuff to be discarded amounted to a smallsh pile of dust and some wood fragments... I have boxes and boxes of quite small plywood and balsa offcuts, for heaven's sake, not to mention drawers full of very small bits of metal...

 

I liked that description of the consumerist rabbit in its warren. Very precise.

 

Cheers,

Alex. 

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Dear Tony

 

I am building one of these out of the box. One thing I have found is the canopy does not got too well. While Fettling in the windscreen, it looks like the fuselage will need filling out with some putty so the bottom of the canopy and windscreen blend in.

 

Regards

Toby

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9 minutes ago, TheBaron said:

 

:thanks: guys. Happy Christmas one and all and speak to you soon.

:bye: Tony

You too kid.  Have a wonderful time, see you on the other side. :lol:

 

Johnny

 

btw Hhiinnggee.:king: 

Edited by The Spadgent
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Hello you lot!

 

Sick of mince pies yet?:rolleyes:

 

I hope you've all been having a spiffingly over-indulgent time since we spoke last. At this end it's been one of the most chilled-out Christmases in ages, which has largely been the result of ignoring TV and other media outlets, and just hunkering down by the fire with the family, eating, reading and watching films on download. Oh. And even some bench time.

 

I've been working on the hinge, testing ideas and more importantly, testing critical angles and distances - the photos I've edited down to just those necessary to give an idea of the essentials of making a working wing-fold, though this is still a bit picture-heavy so I'll do this update in two parts.

 

Pt.I: Hercules Unhinged

Using a drill bit as an ad hoc router, I bored out the wing root at the point where the hinge plate will be mounted. The roughness there is deliberate, in order to give the adhesive something substantial to 'key' onto for a firmer grip. You can see in the top left corner that I accidentally went through too far - that's the mercy of the Barra having decking over the crew compartments as this isn't visible from above, plus it'll give a little more for the adhesive to grip onto here as well:

31849660316_e6b07d4a0b_c.jpg

At this point a whole series of grinds and test-fits proceeded:

31046624124_7d64769304_c.jpg

Not only are you checking continually that nothing is out of true vertically or horizontally, but you have to continually bear in mind that this structure rotates through 90 degrees:

31849661646_f68cbebaa3_c.jpg

In working out the hinge-placement therefore, you can't just stick the hinge on in isolation and expect that too be sufficient. Just because it looks ok visually in the photo below:

31849662346_e4e4c2caae_c.jpg

...doesn't mean that this is correct when you take the rotation of the wing-structure as a whole into account:

31739456072_134c860c71_c.jpg

Not only does it have to work in the fully-extended flight mode, but equally, in the wings-back position:

31887248795_3fe7a309bb_c.jpg

There are two critical points I've learnt that need to be borne in mind at this stage. Not only must the hinge not protrude back beyond the trailing edge of the wing at any point in the radius of rotation - this region will be boxed-in flush later remember as part of the rear wing-fold for the flaps, so you can't having anything protruding.

31739457662_92e7bf65d0_c.jpg

Secondly, in both wings-back and wings-out posture, the point of the triangle formed by the wing-cut at the rear must remain up tight against the fuselage, otherwise there will be a mismatch at some point in the rotation cycle, causing the wing to be displaced incorrectly. This part took a long time to work out correctly; because of all the variable involved, there's only so much you can plan out on paper at this stage - you need to test and test again to make sure that the theory can be applied with the parts you have to work with.

 

 

 

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Pt. II The Toblerone Effect

 

Having spent all that time working out the issues mentioned previously, I slept on it, took Christmas day off, and came back to the matter fresh this morning. Temporarily mounting the hinge in situ with some White-Tak, I switched attention to the other side of the equation, namely the design of a secure fixing for the hinge within the outer wing itself. Bearing in mind this region will experience twist and turn when in use, simply gluing the hinge inside there isn't an option for anything durable. The first task is to mark out a mounting-angle for the hinge that will function in both out:

31887249805_3548f377cd_c.jpg

...and back positions of the folded wing:

31739459232_0a55327287_c.jpg

You can see in the shot below the critical alignment issues that I was talking about in the last post; get this part wrong and all will be for nought:

31887251215_9a4be7aa17_c.jpg

Seen from below, you can see how easy it would be to overlook the critical nature of this fit:

31739460792_c3a6e81d21_c.jpg

Once you've got a proper three-dimensional picture in your head of the working parameters involved, only then should you start marking up:

31887252715_356e6325f2_c.jpg

Don't forget to pay attention to the angles of the wing interior either - these are not at right-angles so need some asymmetric grinding of the hinge in order to provide an accurate fit. Being made of brass, you have the luxury of grinding this hinge down without compromising strength. The only other option would be to grind out the wing instead, which I wouldn't recommend, as it will only weaken the structural integrity:

31514321700_58d1b25620_c.jpg

As you do at this time of year, I've been munching through more than the usual quota of Toblerone, and this has clearly influenced my plan for the outer wing internals: I decided that a secure fixing in there for the hinge could be achieved with a triangular truss, both to keep the hinge angled correctly, but in addition to provide larger contact area for the adhesive (I'm going to use a two-part epoxy to bond the hinge to the plastic on both sides BTW). Casting around on the bench for suitably strong-but-light metal, my eye happened upon a blunt no.11 scalpel blade discarded earlier in the build. Perfect!

 

Grind, grind etc. and we have the required metal components:

31887254055_178c14404c_c.jpg

A quick mock-up and hopefully you get the idea:

31514323570_8e7a3d02b2_c.jpg

Base-plate soldered on (Oh Mr Heath, how you have improved my soldering!:thumbsup2:):

31739465392_014d822993_c.jpg

Followed by a diagonal bracing element:

31887255345_5acdd17d61_c.jpg

At this point you get the Toblerone-triangle idea, but of course, does it actually fit inside, and at the required set of interior angles:

31739466482_3fbe426b7e_c.jpg

Well, on the lower wing, yes, but of course, that's only half the story. There's the top half to consider as well:

31887256285_274de7feb5_c.jpg

Seems to work.  Yay etc. :thumbsup: How are we doing when we offer it up to the fuselage - not without a certain sense of foreboding I might add:

31739467732_a739fd3624_c.jpg

Within limits for flight-posture, but what about wings-back:

31887258055_35fca9eb70_c.jpg

Probably a little bit of fettling required for final positions/angles, but I'm happy with that. It seems to be working. Yo-freakin-ho.

Here's a shot of the hinge/bracket on it's own:

31849658256_4079e49c74_c.jpg

That should, I'm hoping, provide enough stability and spread the load, without imposing any major weight penalty, in both positions:

31046622924_ebd23a7f7c_c.jpg

Right. That will do for today. I'm off to the smoked salmon and horseradish.

 

On Christmas Eve I preformed the annual ritual of digging-up about a foot of horseradish root from the triffid-like plant that sits in the middle of the flower-bed and has proven almost impossible to eradicate. The Baron's recipe for a pukka sinus-clearer:

 

About 3-4" of 1" thick horseradish root (grated)

1 apple, peeled, cored and grated, with the juice squeezed out of the pulp by hand (stops the sauce getting too sloppy if you do that last point)

1 tsp English mustard

2tsp white wine or cider vinegar

1 pinch each of salt, pepper, and sugar.

Mix these together in a bowl with a fork, adding just enough single cream to turn into a, well creamy, sauce. Put into a sealed jar, and this will keep for a few days in the fridge.

 

I hope you're all enjoying yourselves.

:bye: Tony

 

 

 

 

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