RAF Curtiss Tomahawks...

[Nick Millman]

46 minutes ago, HBBates said:

Nick

I'm going to be seeing my buddy with the all the Tomahawk parts still in original colors... I know you spoke of being to analyze the color from samples ...If I can get some skin still in original color... what do you need.. how big?.. or would paint scraping do?.. or photos with some kind of color control sample ?...fyi.. these Tomahawk parts are from the first Russian recovered airframes.. so should be Curtiss colors ..not RAF repainted

 

 

Hi Hume

 

To measure the paint colour a sample about 5cm x 5cm is sufficient but it will depend how much surface variegation there is as it might then be necessary to have several samples. Better to have the paint film still on the substrate if possible with any underlying primer intact rather than scrapings. 

 

Regards

Nick

[airjiml2]

On 10/3/2016 at 6:17 AM, Nick Millman said:

In November 1942 an emblem for all RCAF squadrons operating overseas (e.g. outside Canada) was approved but it cannot always be spotted in photos. It was an 8" diameter roundel with a half-inch outer circle of dark blue and an "RAF blue" centre containing a red maple leaf. It was to be applied on the port side of the fuselage forward of the leading edge.

 

This is a true statement, but outside of a short period of training by 430 Squadron, there were no RCAF Squadrons operating Tomahawks by November 1942.  Both 400 and 414 had converted to Mustangs and 403 had long since converted to Spitfires.

 

Oddly, the "Overseas" marking was adopted by E.O. for Home War Establishment aircraft in April 1943.

 

Jim

[HBBates]

2 hours ago, Nick Millman said:

 

Hi Hume

 

To measure the paint colour a sample about 5cm x 5cm is sufficient but it will depend how much surface variegation there is as it might then be necessary to have several samples. Better to have the paint film still on the substrate if possible with any underlying primer intact rather than scrapings. 

 

Regards

Nick

Well I will see what I can get --if anything-- as I never asked for any parts yet...I'm assuming the under-surface color is the big thing as that seems to always be the big debate 

 

I might be able to get a whole skin panel from under the tail and send to you to test (see photo below.)..If its not destructive of the physical part and I can get it back (I think they they use as replacement skin templates )

 

As you can see from the photo below.. it would be a nice large sample with paint film still on the substrate, underlying primer intact . You can seen that paint is applied to skin with that famous Curtiss "blue tint medal" .. so you should be able to get a good idea on the whole finish process 

 

Edited October 21, 2016 by HBBates

[HBBates]

On 10/21/2016 at 0:59 PM, Nick Millman said:

 

Hi Hume

 

To measure the paint colour a sample about 5cm x 5cm is sufficient but it will depend how much surface variegation there is as it might then be necessary to have several samples. Better to have the paint film still on the substrate if possible with any underlying primer intact rather than scrapings. 

 

Regards

Nick

Nick I got skin samples of original Tomahawk skin, this is one that was recovered out of Archangels some years back they are still in original color. I really wanted to get more but this is the best I could do I don't know if these samples will work.. I can mail them to you if you email me your address I would like to get them back when you're done if possible...

 

note these are from the stabilizer skin  and in speaking to the gentlemen I got this from he was actually at archangel and recovered the part and described it as laying on the ground with the light sky side up all those years and even he thought this sample was bleached out grey and didn't show the blue green he had seen on other pieces 

Edited October 25, 2016 by HBBates

[PhantomBigStu]

Picked up the new rebox of the airfix p-40b today with the makrings for an raf bird in the temperate scheme,  obviusly as per earlier posts the underside is close enough to FS35622 which I'm happy with as I have that in my paint rack, but for the uppers I bit lost as I've seen 3 differently DuPont earths quoted, and not sure how they translate into model paints 

[Nick Millman]

10 hours ago, PhantomBigStu said:

Picked up the new rebox of the airfix p-40b today with the makrings for an raf bird in the temperate scheme,  obviusly as per earlier posts the underside is close enough to FS35622 which I'm happy with as I have that in my paint rack, but for the uppers I bit lost as I've seen 3 differently DuPont earths quoted, and not sure how they translate into model paints 

FWIW 71-035 is close to FS 30099 but the extant paint on parts from Tomahawks in the same serial range as the AVG aircraft is closer to FS 33105 and approximate to the Spec 3-1 colour Field Drab No.303 which was listed as an equivalent to RAF Dark Earth. FS 33105 is marginally closer to the RAF Dark Earth colour standard than the usually quoted 30118 but is not a perfect match being less saturated and less reddish, slightly more yellowish. With variance and weathering taken into account any RAF Dark Earth paint should be ok, perhaps toned down very slightly.

 

Nick    

[PhantomBigStu]

Thanks nick, I'll contiune using my normal dark earth for this then, as the green in unlike raf dark green so should make it look slightly different. Or maybe I'll go and to the model shop for the third time this weak for some humbrol 29 so it's not the same as my raf earth painted builds edit, no humbrol so picked up revels equilavence no87 earth brown, looks good in the pot 

Edited September 29, 2017 by PhantomBigStu

[SelwynWilliams]

I found the wreck of AH845 and I am about to display the artefacts we recovered, among them the port engine exhaust stubs that are marked 87 20 010 L meaning its a 87 Kittyhawk set of (L) port stubs and they are fish tail type.