Pocher Bugatti T50 Coupé de Ville: a resurrection

[sharknose156]

Enjoy Montreal, must be the perfect time of the year.

ps : when on a trip to main cities, if i have the time i try to look for mom & pop model shops and visit them to see if they have old hidden treasures ... may be Montreal has some !?

[CrazyCrank]

Still too warm and stuffy for me, but I leave tomorrow for Tadoussac :-)

For mom & pop shops, I'll take à look, sure

[sharknose156]

Good luck with the mom and pops, you may end up finding yourself a nice old Pocher, Protar or an old lathe !!

This "Tadoussac" sounds like there is good food and nice people there.

[CrazyCrank]

Hello gentlemen and friends

 

I'll be back home within two days,  and already thinking to work a bit on my Lady Bug

 

As I said in a previous post, I've a lot of projects and work on the bench. 

 

I've the certitude that there was an electric fuel gauge on the tank,  my old friend mechanics who worked in the past on vintage cars explain me its operational principle... 

But I've never seen any picture of this part on my reference photos,  nor on the Internet,  despite of my long searches. 

So, I'm looking for documentation, if exists, to connect the fueltank with the fuelgauge on the dashboard...

 

Has everyone any idea ? Such help would be very appreciated. 

 

Regards

 

Dr T. 

 

Edited September 22, 2016 by CrazyCrank

[Roy vd M.]

Louwman Museum in The Hague has a T50 in its collection. They are friendly guys. I'd recommend e-mailing them your questions (be sure to tell them how extensive and detailed your build is) and reckon there's a larger than average chance they can and will provide that info. 

+31 70 304 7373

[email protected]

 

If it doesn't work just let me know and I'll call them.

[CrazyCrank]

2 hours ago, Roy vd M. said:

Louwman Museum in The Hague has a T50 in its collection. They are friendly guys. I'd recommend e-mailing them your questions (be sure to tell them how extensive and detailed your build is) and reckon there's a larger than average chance they can and will provide that info. 

+31 70 304 7373

[email protected]

 

If it doesn't work just let me know and I'll call them.

 

Thanks a  mil,  Roy.. 

I'm going to e-mail them... Will let you know their answer

Regards 

[CrazyCrank]

1 hour ago, CrazyCrank said:

 

Thanks a  mil,  Roy.. 

I'm going to e-mail them... Will let you know their answer

Regards 

 

Done (polite and respectful email with an access on my free Flickr gallery where is stored all my building story) .... Finger crossing 

[CrazyCrank]

Back home ! Hello friends 

 

No response of Lowman museum at the moment....

It doesn't matter...I've also a lot to do !

 

[sharknose156]

Welcome back, Go for it !!

 

Am traveling monday for 10 days to the Middle East, but i am taking some small bits and pieces of my Mephisto to work on.

( Pity compressors and paint booths are cumbersome and not easy to travel with  )

[CrazyCrank]

Holidays have achieved, at work now !

 

I've planned to modify, if possible, the braking system of my Bug, including little sections of chain in the cables ends, and replacing some pulleys by sprockets, as on the prototype car.

So, I've ordered a 1:12 scale motorbike chain from Hiro Factory, that seemed to be convenient for my project

I've received it today

The mounting process appears to require great care and precision , due to small sample size of the links: 1.15 mm thickness and 2.6 mm width, approximatively.

    

Here a link to a Youtube video (not mine of course) for a similar chain:

 

Assembly of a 1:12 scale motorbike chain

My first impression is that the chain size will work well for my purpose.

I think working on it wednesday, if I find in my stash a soldering iron with an ultra-thin tip, and make tries.

If it goes, will remain to scratchbuild or purchase appropriate sprockets, and modify the kit to install the modified brake cables.

More to see later, so

Edited September 26, 2016 by CrazyCrank

[sharknose156]

Thanks very much for this very valuable info.

Am watching with great attention as i am also planning to replace the chains in my Meph.

[CrazyCrank]

You're welcome my friend.

I'll post here the building of that chain with as many details as always.

 

But for your Meph', although this chain is 1:12 scale, am not sure it would work for that car...You must verify the size of the kit links and compare with the dimensions I've mentionned .

 

 

Edited September 27, 2016 by CrazyCrank

[sharknose156]

Yes indeed i will. Thank you.  Currently i feel like a cast-away since am very far from my bench... will be back there mid-next week. However i am redoing some parts of the engine still, so will get to the chains in about a couple of weeks.

 

PS: i was re-reading your 20 hours on the grill.... amazing truly.

 

Enjoy the chain.

Edited September 27, 2016 by sharknose156

[bzn20]

I found a 20 page build on a German model forum. You might find pictures of things you were looking for. Its in German too but a picture is worth more than etc..

http://www.wettringer-modellbauforum.de/forum/index.php?page=Thread&threadID=56149&pageNo=10

 

[CrazyCrank]

2 hours ago, bzn20 said:

I found a 20 page build on a German model forum. You might find pictures of things you were looking for. Its in German too but a picture is worth more than etc..

http://www.wettringer-modellbauforum.de/forum/index.php?page=Thread&threadID=56149&pageNo=10

 

 

Thank you very much, bzn20, to have found a build that I knew but had forgotten and lost !

 

It is really an amazing job, very interesting and it gave me some ideas, and some inspiration... ideas of what was possible and necessary to do, and ideas too of what I wanted overall not to do !

 

I don't want to denigrate this fantastic work, but there is inconsistencies and a surprising blend of perfect achievement on many points, and a lack of details on several others, or out-of-scale elements.

For instance, there is a beautiful but unrealistic (because out-of-scale and very diffreent of the real one) engine-turning pattern on the engine cam covers , and there is not the same on the firewall, where it should have appeared, as in the prototype. Furthermore, bolts on the cam covers are too long, however it would have been easy to shorten them....

Another example: the rubber black tubing of fuel supply on the carburetors is absolutely unrealistic, and a real insult to this mythic car....

 

So a great but uneven work, in my humble opinion !

 

I 'm not claiming I make better, but I always try to be the closest as possible of the real, and when in doubt, I abstain.

 

But anyways, it's a nice job, his painting is excellent, the simulated wood-veneer on the dashboard and doors is a great and lovely idea, that give life to it

 

If by accident,  Alfa159, the modeller, read me, I apologize for the criticism, that I wanted constructive and not destructive...

 

And, gentlemen, rest assured that I'm able to wishstand the same criticism, and that I would ask you to do them, as you feel required, without fearing hurting me....

 

 

 

 

Edited September 28, 2016 by CrazyCrank

[CrazyCrank]

Always no firewall supports of MMC at the post-office, so, I've begun to work on the brake system

 

And first, as I've planned to replace the pulleys of front wheels brakes by sprockets, placing a piece of chain on the brake cable way (in accordance to the reference photos, see below), I need 2 sprockets, one for each wheel.

 

Butt, in the set I've bought of 1:12 motorcycle chain, there is only 1 little sprocket (the output gearbox, pignon), with 15 teeth, this one:

 

 

To notice: this sprocket is cast soft metal, and I've drilled it in its center, because it's destined to replace the pulley, and so, must thread on a shaft

 

 

Nota: on the real car, the sprockets have 13 teeth, if I'm not mistaken. I break the rule I set out, using a 15 teeth sprocket, my apologies for that !

 

I've searched in my treasure boxes, my supply of gears of all types, have rummaged all the drawers of my garage, and not found everything that would be instantly usable as a 15 teeth gear.

 

So, discouraged, I decided to try scratch-building one, trying to be the closest as possible of the pinion.

 

I've used this nylon gear, that, fortunately, has 15 teeth too, and a quite identical diameter: 8.3 mm instead of 7.2, but is much more thicker, and mounted on a nylon shaft :

 

  

 

I've put the shaft in a toy-tool (my Unimat one lathe), and reduced the thickness of the gear, sanding it whith a cardboard file.

Then I've reduced the diameter of the gear, unfortunately a little bit, getting a diameter of 6.6 mm....At the moment, I've decided not to make another, waiting the achievement of this piece, to compare them, particularly given that there is only one of them on each side, and that the chain will probably fit well, despite of this little difference.

Then, cutted the nylon shaft with a thin blade, on the lathe.

Then spent a long time to file the teeth of the nylon sprocket, next, cutted a little piece of brass tube, inserted on center of the sprocket, an got that:

 

 

On the left, you can see the nylon sprocket with below the little piece of brass tube, and on the right the metal sprocket of the Factory Hiro kit.

 

 

And now, the tries of fitting

 

On the car kit, you have this pulley on the brake system:

 

 

On the real car, you have this system:

 

 

One can see that the pinion shaft is offset of the shaft that joins the drum and the front axle.

I'm going to break the rule for the second time, because, at this scale, it's very hard to do, and what is important to see is that there is a sprocket and a chain on the brake cable way

 

So my build gives actually that with the Hiro Factory metal sprocket, on the left drum

 

 

A try with the nylon sprocket before painting it, on the right drum:

 

 

I've painted my nylon white sprocket with Alclad Stainless steel, and got this:

 

 

And, once installed on the right drum shaft:

 

 

And at least an overview, where you can notice the little difference of diameter of the sprockets:

 

 

On the left, teeth of metal sprocket passes the washer, and on the right, teeth of nylon sprocket are a bit  hidden by the washer

 

Sprockets can spine freely on their shaft, as in reality.. They spine freely around the little brass tube, and washes above and below prevent the light vertical trembling  that occured while testing rotation.

 

I would like to know what's your feeling about it, because my first impression is that it's not so bad, despite of the diameter difference between these sprockets, and my vagrancies concerning the truth of the real system.

 

If you think I must make another sprocket of the right size, tell me, because I've found another forgotten treasure: a second nylon gear of 8.18 mm diameter and 15 teeth !!!

That wouldn't take long....only 3 or 4 hours of work ! But not sure I would make better, because  while sanding nylon on the lathe to get a right diameter, it is very easy going too far, as nylon is very tender.

 

 

Nota: Of course, when i'll install the chain around the nylon right sprocket, if the chain is not restrained by sprocket and fall while braking, it will be obligatory to redo this work !

 

Stay tuned for next episode: building of pieces of chain.

 

 

Edited September 28, 2016 by CrazyCrank

[CrazyCrank]

Finally, I was a bit unsatisfied, my perfection-research devil probably, and I've scratch-built another nylon sprocket, with the "exact" diameter, perhaps still a little bit thicker, but that will be easy to fix, if chain wouldn't fit, and I've always the possibility to make another if necessary...

 

 

Better, isn't it ?

 

Crazy CrazyCrank 

 

[sharknose156]

yes better definitely. Great work !

[CrazyCrank]

8 minutes ago, sharknose156 said:

yes better definitely. Great work !

 

Thanks for this comment, Sharknose....it confirms that I had to fix that difference between the two sprockets.

 

It's not  impossible that I evenly undertake to replace  the first pulleys mounted on the frame, just after those of drums, by sprockets, and a piece of chain, of course...

To get something like that:

 

[Codger]

Theirry, your dedication to authenticity is amazing. Your fabrication skills make that level of detail attainable. You would still have a wonderful model without this detail but this type work elevates it further.

 

I can't believe that the real car had such a dangerous collection of wires, chain, clevises and sprockets to actuate something as important (and heavily used) as the brakes! Exposure to dirt and corrosion made it more prone to failure.

 

But you have captured it very well; sadly much will not be visible when the body is in place. But having this photos is very valuable. Great work - like all the other layers of detail you've made.

[roymattblack]

Absolutely outstanding.

You're making me look at my Bug box on top of a wardrobe every time I pass it...

 

Roy.

[CrazyCrank]

Thank you very much,Codger and Roy for these kind  and poetic words.

They encourage me to continue on this path.

 

@Roy: I hope I'll see your building of that Bug, because, taking account of your skills in scratching parts, among many others,  this will promise to be a delight for our eyes

 

@Codger: I appreciate your ability to congratulate so precisely, with simple and just words, ,each modeler you meet.

 

Concerning the braking system of the Bug, it was in reality simpliest than the RR 's one, and so, much more easy to maintain. Very simple to adjust or repair with spare parts, very simple to lubricate.

And the chains on the brake cable path weren't fragiler than our actual motorcycle chains, and probably infinintely fewer, because they didn't spine permanently.

Furthermore, not much exposed to dust and rust than the motorcycle ones, and very easy to grease.

The steel cables were much more subjected, but are very resistant....look at the shrouds of a sailboat, which support enormous draft forces, and don't break !

 

At last, when the body is placed on the frame, all this little job with sprockets and chain will remain visible, in front view...with a big Maglite of course....it doesn't matter, I'llknow this work is there.

 

 

 

[Dr. Fiat]

Incredible level of detail- and I especially admire that you went the extra mile to match up both sprockets.  Can't wait to see your little chain mounted up with clevises and watch it work!!!

[Roy vd M.]

Simply beautiful details, how I'd love to have a realistic car model like that standing as the masterpiece in my living room... 

[CrazyCrank]

26 minutes ago, Roy vd M. said:

Simply beautiful details, how I'd love to have a realistic car model like that standing as the masterpiece in my living room... 

 

Thanks Roy for this nice comment....not so complicated, if you have the Pocher kit !

 

By the way, I didn't get any answer for my mail to Lowman Museum.....do you think you could call them, as you kindly offered me next week ?