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The EDSG files #1: 1/72 Sea Venom FAW.21


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'...and every where the blue sky belongs to them'

Samuel Taylor Coleridge, Gloss to the Rime of the Ancient Mariner.

'Invert the aircraft, release harnesses and fall out'

Emergency handling procedure from Sea Venom Pilot's Notes.

Hello again all,

The madness is upon me again!

It's been a while since I posted anything visual, largely as I've had no real bench time at all of late, but after faffing around I've decided to do a sequence of related builds for the next year or so of various Fleet Air Arm aircraft from the 50s and 60s. Some classic jets and choppers from that era, that a recent visit to Yeovilton has rekindled my affection for.

Here's some bench shots of the Frog 1:72 Sea Venom FAW.21 that will be the first in the series. Let's start with the good news: the decals seems usable and in good condition. Aaaaaaaand that's it for the good news... :hmmm:

22_zpsixnfrq2z.jpg

This splendid-looking aircraft has been subject of a number of builds already on BM, and whilst I love these older kits like Frog, can you see all that blasted flash? :confused: It looks more like a Frank Auerbach painting of a kit with all that baroque plasticity. Have a closer look and you'll see what I mean:

23_zpsf8m61fbl.jpg

As to the glazing :blink:

24_zpskwoesezv.jpg

I'm thinking this was originally intended as an insect eye rather than a canopy. Have I been given part of the old Airfix Praying Mantis kit in error? Pity the poor crew of this thing though; the moulding guys really went for a lovely 'Facehugger from Alien' approach - I'll have to call this crate 'Nostromo' now:

25_zpsvcy6ujts.jpg

Seriously. Did this kit partially melt in the post on the way over due to the recent heatwave or something??? :huh:

Actually, I have my suspicions that as this was bought unboxed (and hence dirt cheap), it may not be an original Frog moulding as advertised but a later iteration - was the original mould of this kit ever this flashy BITD?

S-oo..after having foresworn kits that need lots of correction (after my previous Dark Night of the Matchbox Meteor Night Fighter) here I am back with another kit needing as much attention probably. Of course I'm moaning too much. It's my own fault for buying it and I could always throw it away and buy a decent version. But you know I won't. I've got etch. 1/72 etch....

26_zps6mdun3eg.jpg

That will make it all better, won't it? :P

I've some :book: yet to do on colour and airframe details, but the notion at this stage is to to just go the whole hog, wingfolds and all, and see how we get on. BTW I noticed that Falcon do a really nice FAA vacform canopy set that included most of the aircraft I hope to do in this series, as well as that snazzy Model Alliance decal set for the Ark Royal air wing that also covers many of them, so I may have to break my embargo on any more purchases this month. :fuyou_2: bank manager...

It's going to be a busy summer work-wise; I'll have to grab time at the bench as and when I can get it so my updates may not be as regular as I would hope. The main thing is that I hope you get to enjoy the journey and please pitch in as often as you want with any criticism and advice of my attempts to subdue this monster :bye:

Tony

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That is definitely a Russian re-pop, the original kit was very crisply moulded and had a very clear, if rather thick canopy. I believe Tasman models market the Squadron canopy separately if you do not want to buy the complete set.

Martin

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That is definitely a Russian re-pop, the original kit was very crisply moulded and had a very clear, if rather thick canopy. I believe Tasman models market the Squadron canopy separately if you do not want to buy the complete set.

Martin

Hi Martin!

I figured as much, as many of the reviews I read were quite favourable about the mould quality of the Frog offering and I was surprised at what I received in the post. Thanks for the Tasman pointer as well :thumbsup2: I'm veering towards a splurge on the Falcon FAA set as they look good value for the money. Ahh well. A 'challenging' build lies ahead then...hopefully it might help people to see how an unpromising version like this can be rescued if I can pull it off.

With that in mind, I just did a quick dry-fit to have a closer look:

22_zpsrabxg39p.jpg

You can actually get a good sense of the quality of the original mould under all that flash, as although the panel lines are raised, the model seems quite well-detailed for it's vintage. I'll check it for accuracy against Chris Bowley's plans in the Warpaint volume over the weekend.

23_zpsltffvoer.jpg

Thankfully I decided to take the plunge and order some Mr.Surfacer last week to see what people are raving about, as there are a few seams here and there that will need taking care of:

24_zps0sbghfox.jpg

The wing-tank fins are too thick, as are the strakes along the wing near the wing-fold, but the Airwaves sets seem pretty well provided for with such replacement details. The only problem will be the usual one of having enough surface area on the etch to attach it securely enough to the plastic.

25_zpsqhx6oqge.jpg

27_zpsnmirhszc.jpg

I note also that one of the etch sets comes with a radar installation for under the radome :owww: I thought I'd left that behind me on the NF.14. Should I give it a go on this one as well? :frantic:

Some of the openings leave a lot for the the imagination to fill in. The jet nozzle only has a quite crude-looking nozzle for the Ghost, so I'll have to scratch something finer for that:

28_zps5cjrlshg.jpg

The intakes at the front will need boring out also, though I notice some intake covers in the brass so I'll defer that decision until later:

26_zpsxvbk0qlk.jpg

From a first walkaround the main parts of the airframe it looks like another rescribe job is on the cards <_< though I'll leave the raised lines in place until the last minute as guides for scribing (if they match the Warpaint plans closely enough that is..).

At this stage then, my initial dismay has altered to thinking that this will be fun little kit to do (despite my earlier belly-aching!). There's plenty of scope for some judicious scratch building, and the Airwaves sets have an impressive range of bits. Plus there's something intrinsically enchanting about doing a twin-boomer*...

Consilio suo, et patientia :bye:
*not a euphemism...
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Gordon Bennett! That might be the worst flash I've ever encountered - but I have no doubt that you will produce a Silk Purse none the less.

I don't really do 1/72, so I am hoping that the rumours that Tarangus will soon work their way Sea Venom-wards in 1/48 are true, or this interesting type will remain a huge gap in my own FAA build plan. Having spent a good year wrestling with de Havilland's next offering to the RN, I shall be watching your progress with interest.

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That is definitely a Russian re-pop, the original kit was very crisply moulded and had a very clear, if rather thick canopy. I believe Tasman models market the Squadron canopy separately if you do not want to buy the complete set.

Martin

I still have the Tasman boxing of that kit. The original canopy certainly is thick - it must be a good 3mm. The Scale Aircraft Modelling reviewer (Mike Mac?) suggested that the canopy was left in the kit as a dire warning.

I wonder how long it's been lying around unfinished. I've long since forgotten when I bought it, which was shortly after its release.

I might just get the Airwaves brass for it now, if it's still available.

Edited by JosephLalor
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OK, I'll say it...

You are aware that that you could have bought one of these https://www.scalemates.com/kits/100799-cyber-hobby-5096-de-havilland-sea-venom-faw-21

good luck!

Will

Stick with the Frog kit, its basic but accurate in shape and is character building.

The Cyberhobby kit is unworthy.

http://www.britmodeller.com/forums/index.php?/topic/234914662-dragon-sea-venom-faw-21-second-impressions/?hl=cyber+hobby+sea+venom

Edited by NAVY870
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I may be noted round here as a mouldyerown canopy kind of guy but the Falcon canopy set is one I'm proud to have purchased, it is a gem

And I bought an ex-Frog-mould kit like yours at the Shropshire Modellers show in April, just as much misplaced flash but as you've been advised a quite nice model underneath it all

Mine is the Frog Buccaneer mould but my canopy is even worserer than yours, it's greyish clearish plastic :)

Point of which is that I do have the original Frog model to build some time soon, a certain "other" Sea Venom build recently gave me the incentive to get it out soon hence buying the Falcon set for the Bucc and the Sea Venom, also gives me the clear parts for the Gannet I've had in my "non-stash with parts missing" file

So

I am going to watch and practise along with you, if it weren't for my Hansom awaiting rigging and the driver I'd actually follow part by part, it might be fun

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Hi Fella

Good to see you start something else, that is a lot of Flash !!!. Will watch with interest as I have the Premiere version to build which is basically the old Frog Kit with some white metal cockpit details such as IP, canopy strengthening rib and seats, also has a Vacform canopy too. I think Tasman models do some bits for this too such as the canopy FYI.

Good luck. I am still doing the meteor but have not had much time to spend modelling lately.

All the best
Chris

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Holy sh....... Moses, there is mpr flash than kit! You appear to be a fan of kicking these old kits into touch!

I really like the DH twin boom jets (just bought a vampire trainer from airfix, looking to put it on my daughters ceiling, appears she is a fan of a twin boom as well.... The boy only excepts shark mouthed aircraft.) will be nice to see how you plush this tu..... Kit...... (Or at least roll it in glitter)

Rob

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I strongly suggest that you obtain the Tasman Upgrade set. Canopies, white metal bits and pieces, decals and a comprehensive set of instructions with detail photographs. Been around for years but still very worthwhile. One source is:

http://www.jaysmodelkits.com/jaysmk/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=76&products_id=747

HTH

Richard in NZ

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Gordon Bennett! That might be the worst flash I've ever encountered - but I have no doubt that you will produce a Silk Purse none the less.

I don't really do 1/72, so I am hoping that the rumours that Tarangus will soon work their way Sea Venom-wards in 1/48 are true, or this interesting type will remain a huge gap in my own FAA build plan. Having spent a good year wrestling with de Havilland's next offering to the RN, I shall be watching your progress with interest.

Crisp: Silk Purse eh? No pressure then! :lol: I've been drooling over that Sea Vixen of yours for some time - you've done it proud, it's gorgeous. What is it about twin-boom naval aircraft of that period? I've a FAW.2 Vixen in 1/72 stashed away for later in this series, so needless to say I've been taking notes on your painting experiences. I'll keep an eye on Tarangus' offerings in 'that other scale' - cheers for the heads-up.

I still have the Tasman boxing of that kit. The original canopy certainly is thick - it must be a good 3mm. The Scale Aircraft Modelling reviewer (Mike Mac?) suggested that the canopy was left in the kit as a dire warning.

I wonder how long it's been lying around unfinished. I've long since forgotten when I bought it, which was shortly after its release.

I might just get the Airwaves brass for it now, if it's still available.

Joseph: Welcome to the thread! Hannants still have a few copies of the stuff I'm using in stock:

https://www.hannants.co.uk/product/AEC72162

https://www.hannants.co.uk/product/AEC72163

OK, I'll say it...

You are aware that that you could have bought one of these https://www.scalemates.com/kits/100799-cyber-hobby-5096-de-havilland-sea-venom-faw-21

good luck!

Will

Will: Where's the challenge in that? Plus Cyber Hobby forgot to put any flash on theirs... :coolio:

Stick with the Frog kit, its basic but accurate in shape and is character building.

The Cyberhobby kit is unworthy.

http://www.britmodeller.com/forums/index.php?/topic/234914662-dragon-sea-venom-faw-21-second-impressions/?hl=cyber+hobby+sea+venom

Steve: Hello again! Dead right. I'd prefer an older but more accurate kit that needs some TLC, rather than a newer one with 'issues'. Thanks for the link - excellent reading.

I may be noted round here as a mouldyerown canopy kind of guy but the Falcon canopy set is one I'm proud to have purchased, it is a gem

And I bought an ex-Frog-mould kit like yours at the Shropshire Modellers show in April, just as much misplaced flash but as you've been advised a quite nice model underneath it all

Mine is the Frog Buccaneer mould but my canopy is even worserer than yours, it's greyish clearish plastic :)

Point of which is that I do have the original Frog model to build some time soon, a certain "other" Sea Venom build recently gave me the incentive to get it out soon hence buying the Falcon set for the Bucc and the Sea Venom, also gives me the clear parts for the Gannet I've had in my "non-stash with parts missing" file

So

I am going to watch and practise along with you, if it weren't for my Hansom awaiting rigging and the driver I'd actually follow part by part, it might be fun

Perdu: Welcome to the thread! You've now made me incline even more strongly to investing in that Falcon set now - for the same reason as yourself, having a few FAA builds it will cover. Glad to hear about the quality of them, as well being an economical investment. Hope you enjoy the ride/journey/rollercoaster, whatever this turns out to be! :winkgrin:

Hi Fella

Good to see you start something else, that is a lot of Flash !!!. Will watch with interest as I have the Premiere version to build which is basically the old Frog Kit with some white metal cockpit details such as IP, canopy strengthening rib and seats, also has a Vacform canopy too. I think Tasman models do some bits for this too such as the canopy FYI.

Good luck. I am still doing the meteor but have not had much time to spend modelling lately.

All the best

Chris

Chris: Hello again! Sorry to hear you're not getting much modelling time at present mate. I'd heard good things about the additions in that Premiere set - it seems a clever idea, given the numbers of us who still like updating those classic older kits of particular aircraft. If someone would only do the same thing to turn the old Airfix Scout into a Wasp I'd be a :yahoo: bunny...

Holy sh....... Moses, there is mpr flash than kit! You appear to be a fan of kicking these old kits into touch!

I really like the DH twin boom jets (just bought a vampire trainer from airfix, looking to put it on my daughters ceiling, appears she is a fan of a twin boom as well.... The boy only excepts shark mouthed aircraft.) will be nice to see how you plush this tu..... Kit...... (Or at least roll it in glitter)

Rob

Rob: Wotcha! Maybe modelling brings out my masochistic side...wait! That means I'm a modelling Gimp- Oh No! :analintruder:

Intrigued by the gender issues on twin-boomers and shark-mouths: is that why I never buy civilian airliners...

I strongly suggest that you obtain the Tasman Upgrade set. Canopies, white metal bits and pieces, decals and a comprehensive set of instructions with detail photographs. Been around for years but still very worthwhile. One source is:

http://www.jaysmodelkits.com/jaysmk/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=76&products_id=747

HTH

Richard in NZ

Richard: Hello there! Thanks for the links to the Tasman gear. I've already splurged on the brass and probably going to shell out on some Falcon clearvax stuff on economic (as well as quality) grounds, but Tasman definitely go on my 'watch' list now. Cheers! :thumbsup2:

Tony

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Hi Tony

A wasp conversion for the scout would be a cracking idea, would love one of those too !!!. keep up the good work. Going to be able to do some modelling myself so will get some more done on the Meteor and a Tiffie that I am building and hopefully on a Bird class Loco I have been building too.

All the best
Chris

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Well, that's the first step taken. I just had a lively hour de-flashing the beastie. This is what came off:

22_zpsxadxgjpp.jpg

And this is what emerged:

23_zpsblejhln2.jpg

It's roughly cleaned-off at this stage, the finer sanding will wait until the asssembly stage. I really just wanted to get this part done as soon as possible in order to see what needs remedying.

One of the wing-roots doesn't look too clever at the rear:

24_zpsrvmrcc2w.jpg

I'm not sure if a straightforward glue n' clamp manouevre will be robust enough here. Hmmm - any ideas?

The region at the front where the intake meets the fuselage doesn't look quite right either:

29_zpssabeogvw.jpg

In reality there is a slight scalloping on that flat lozenge-like raised panel that sticks out in advance of the intake, forwards along the fuselage. I'm not sure is this part some kind of anti-noise or vortex feature, but it will need rectifying on the model. I've no file this fine so another solution of some kind will be required. Grind it off and build something myself perhaps?

As to the bits that go bang, those cannon ports will need drilling out. These look particularly blunted in appearance compared to the real thing:

26_zpsj8msnsvj.jpg

Anyone know if the cannon nozzles were actually visible? I've no contemporary close-ups and any photos I've seen of restored SVs in museums presumably have the weaponry removed.

The whoosh parts also look a bit beefy:

27_zpsinslltdp.jpg

As you can see, in cross-section those rocket fins ( as well as possibly the rails mounting the rockets!) look far too thick. There's some etch for the fins but it'll be a bugger to fix them square without some kind of jig at this scale. Another head-scratcher as to a solution...

Genuinely not sure how this arrestor hook compares to the real thing:

28_zps9bagruul.jpg

If anyone has any pictures of that rear underside of the tail where the hook is mounted, as well as the engine exhaust, I'd be most grateful for the info as I've a blank in my visual research on those bits.

I may actually get to stick something together before the weekend is out! :shocked:

Thanks for looking :thumbsup2:

Tony

Update: Your message popped up just as I was writing Chris: looking forwards to seeing that Meteor. Is your train build up on the forum as well?

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Good luck with that Airwaves PE. My only experience with that stuff was a " never again" one...it was horrible...didn't fit and was inaccurate too! (That was the Revell Nieuport 28 btw). I don't think I used even one piece.....

Ian

Edited by limeypilot
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Hi Tony

Did not get anything done on the Meteor last night but will today. The loco is not on here yet I will post some RFI piccies of it when it is done, it is the old Airfix City of Truro built into a working Bird Class loco, am quite chuffed (OMG) with it!!!

Thanks and all the best

I am itching to start my Sea Venom now, but I must resist>

All the best
Chris

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Blimey more flash than a blinged up dodgy used car salesman. Enough left over plastic for another kit. I do have the CMR resin version, just aint got the bottle to start it. Will follow with interest and look forward to an old school modelling makeover and a little philosophy along the way.

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Well ok. It seems like I missed the start but I'm along for the ride. :popcorn: this old kit stuff is great and terrible in equal measure. You have made a wonderful start on this one. Sea venom eh? Nice bird, one day I'll make one. :D

Stay frosty.

Jont.

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The region at the front where the intake meets the fuselage doesn't look quite right either:

In reality there is a slight scalloping on that flat lozenge-like raised panel that sticks out in advance of the intake, forwards along the fuselage. I'm not sure is this part some kind of anti-noise or vortex feature, but it will need rectifying on the model. I've no file this fine so another solution of some kind will be required. Grind it off and build something myself perhaps?

As to the bits that go bang, those cannon ports will need drilling out. These look particularly blunted in appearance compared to the real thing:

Anyone know if the cannon nozzles were actually visible? I've no contemporary close-ups and any photos I've seen of restored SVs in museums presumably have the weaponry removed.

The whoosh parts also look a bit beefy:

As you can see, in cross-section those rocket fins ( as well as possibly the rails mounting the rockets!) look far too thick. There's some etch for the fins but it'll be a bugger to fix them square without some kind of jig at this scale. Another head-scratcher as to a solution...

Genuinely not sure how this arrestor hook compares to the real thing:

If anyone has any pictures of that rear underside of the tail where the hook is mounted, as well as the engine exhaust, I'd be most grateful for the info as I've a blank in my visual research on those bits.

I may have one or two Sea Venom photo's laying about that may assist :)

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I may have one or two Sea Venom photo's laying about that may assist :)

He means he has a real Sea Venom to play with!

Martin

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He means he has a real Sea Venom to play with!

Martin

4 of them actually :)

Back end and intake piccies of WZ.907, hopefully these are useful.

_6253458_zpsk5rv31ga.jpg

_6253425_zps266rqm1i.jpg

_A135362_zps7nknprxr.jpg

_9173869_zpsie6augnn.jpg

Edited by NAVY870
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Great pictures Steve, thanks

I got my bag of Froggy bits out (I'll post some comparitive pics later..talk about different!) and I see I'm missing the gunport/nosewheel panel. Small bit of scratching there, so it'd be nice to find a decent picture of that area ...hint.hint....

I do find I'm getting quite a pash on for esdg lately

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