The Dual Build Diaries - A Meatbox Apocalypse! 1/72 edition

[TheBaron]

So. Here's a thing. When I first joined this forum back in March, myself and John (The Spadgent) both ended up simultaneously building Fairey Swordfishes (Swodfishii?) by pure chance - he a spanking 1:48 Tamiya build, and myself a reprise of the old 1:72 Matchbox job. Having throughly enjoyed the experience of posting two differently-scaled WIPs of the same aircraft back-to-back, we've decided to go ahead and do a synchronized dual-scale build again - this time of the venerable Meteor. It'll either be 'Butch and Sundance' or 'The Two Ronnies' - it could go either way...

Cheers - John & Tony

PS. You'll find John's F.1 up here:

http://www.britmodeller.com/forums/index.php?/topic/235002363-the-dual-build-diaries-a-meatbox-apocalypse-148-edition/

Of the three versions the Matchbox kit offers, I'm going to build the NF.14 variant from 85 Sqn. TBH I just prefer the canopy - the prior NF marks had that 'Edwardian greenhouse' canopy that must have played merry hell with visibility and situational awareness. And before anyone sends up a warning flare - John Aero has already briefed me about not using the NF.14 nose that Matchbox supply and using the correct NF.12 length one...

Anyhoo. The obligatory deboxification of the three coloured sprues.

...come up and see my etchings...

Not a bad moulding for its vintage, though that gunsight fitting and joystick look a bit on the steroid-abuse side..

I noticed that the light green sprue when held up against the daylight is astonishingly translucent:

The panel lines on the wings are also surprisingly restrained so I'm hoping overall not to have to do too much filling and rescribing on this one. Just admiring the delicate baroque edge to the port aileron. Wait....What?

Hmm..that wing root could double as a Somme diorama...

You've probably seen the amount of filling other makers of this kit have had to do. The cockpit surround and nose area are experiencing marital difficulties....

Actually the nose is going to have a bit of cosmetic surgery as I've decided that although I'm going with the markings and paint scheme off the box, I'm going to do this build with the nose removed to show the radar. There appears an absolute lack of photos showing this NF.14 radar installation so I'm going to be working from a line drawing in the Pilot's Notes and a more detailed graphic most kindly sent to me by NAVY870 of the AI.21 from a FAW.22, as they both used the same set.

Those Hispanos look a bit Wiley-Coyote here. 'One of us will have to go' as Oscar Wilde quipped...

After a dry fit to confirm my fears that the UK filler industry is about to experience a golden age of prosperity, down to the first adherences...aaaand already the instructions and the parts are agreeing to disagree. The drawing shows a nice clear area in front of the joystick, whilst the model appears to include a shoeshine stand for the pilot. Actually I think it's meant to be the lower part of the IP but bears no relation to the actual aircraft:

Fiddling with the PE whilst I muse over what to do with the above. Some nice detailing in this set, such as the map stowage, elevator trim wheel and rear radar console. Not sure about those gulleys for the rudder pedals though - I've bent them exactly as per the instructions, yet they look suspiciously large.

Having Dremeled off that shoeshine unit and test-fitted the pedal gulleys, it's evident these are not exactly in scale.

I've had to make my own from biro refills. You can see the size difference below. Even my reduced-size ones still look a tad beefy but they'll do, given how little that region of the pit is visible once it's all tucked away in the fuselage. Have you noticed how pleased that joystick is to see you? I fear that's going to have to be replaced as well on the grounds of exagerrated girth.

I'm sensing some size issue building up here. The front 'shelf' and gunsight area seem too big and stand out too proud of the cockpit edges compared to photo documentation. As for that 'roll-cage' behind the pilot's seat, it's trying to be the framework behind the pilot's seat into which the shoulder straps pass. That's coming out too.

Swordfish rocket racks are the gift that keeps on giving. A bit of razor-sawing and this is the umpteenth time they've been to the rescue, on this occasion to give more depth to the observer's radar console.

The console is something of a compromise. In the NF.14 there is the lower unit with the CRT displays and controls for the AI.21, and then a framework holding a smaller console above it that seemed to have repeaters for the altitude and IAS instrumentation. I've added some frame work but at this scale I won't go to the length of sawing off and reattaching the top unit onto the framework I've built as it'll be the first thing I snap off. The blue bits are the PE interiors temporarily positioned with Blue-Tack so that I could test fit this whole upper assembly into the lower fuselage.

The rebuilt front of the cockpit, with a gunsight built from scrap PE. Apologies for picture quality - I got all fancy thinking I'd hold a cheap magnifying lens in front of the camera to make a macro-shot. Don't. It just gives the whole thing a 'third pint of scrumpy' aesthetic...

In the process of delicately gluing / clumsily bending the PE to fit the interior curvature. Actually it's not as brutal as it looks, it's just that you have to trim off some of the front of the PE as it jams up against the IP once that has the PE instrumentation on it as well.

That's it for tonight. Hopefully you've enjoyed it so far. John should be on later with his 1:48 version - I'll add a link to his topic once he's got it posted up.

Thanks for looking

Tony

Edited May 12, 2016 by TheBaron

[Duncan B]

Good luck with this one, they are hard work but well worth the effort in the end.

Duncan B

[stever219]

Have fun; I've built a few of these.

Don't fix your etched side walls to the inside of the fuselage walls: the Meteor cockpit from Mk. 1 to 14 had provision for the blast tubes for the fuselage-mounted cannon between the cockpit walls and the fuselage skin. The inner cockpit walls are vertical and almostin line (slightly outboard) with the canopy sills when viewed from above.

Whatever else you do don't use the nose parts that Matchbox would have you use for the Mk. 14: the 12 and 14 used the same radar in the same radome. Someone, somewhere, added in an extra 17" to the Mk. 14's length in a published reference and it's been quoted ever since. There's at least one other Meteor thread on here that covers this, so for a 14 use the nose parts Matchbox give you for the 12 and job's done.

[TheBaron]

Have fun; I've built a few of these.

Don't fix your etched side walls to the inside of the fuselage walls: the Meteor cockpit from Mk. 1 to 14 had provision for the blast tubes for the fuselage-mounted cannon between the cockpit walls and the fuselage skin. The inner cockpit walls are vertical and almostin line (slightly outboard) with the canopy sills when viewed from above.

Whatever else you do don't use the nose parts that Matchbox would have you use for the Mk. 14: the 12 and 14 used the same radar in the same radome. Someone, somewhere, added in an extra 17" to the Mk. 14's length in a published reference and it's been quoted ever since. There's at least one other Meteor thread on here that covers this, so for a 14 use the nose parts Matchbox give you for the 12 and job's done.

Thanks for that reminder on the verticality issue on the interiors. I'll have to rejig that.

I was aware of the nose issue from John Aero's posts on this forum. The No.12 nose it is!

[Tomoshenko]

Great start and certainly a challenge. For some reason I missed the conclusion of your Stringbad build... Will check that out and get back to you...

[The Spadgent]

Go on my son. Blimey that's a cracking start. I think you have more PE detail than me to ram into that pit. I fear I'm going to have to up my scratch build game if my 1/48 brother is going to match your handy work.

I still can't get my head around the three colour sprues, madness I tells ya. good luck with the exposed radar. This is going to be a doosie.

John

[Martian]

Nice start with that etch!

Martin

[TheBaron]

Nice start with that etch!

Martin

Thanks Martin. I'm going to have to find some way of keeping the interior walls vertical so guess I'll be building some mini-ribbing later. Some of the etch parts in this kit are so absolutely minuscule though that finding enough surface area to glue solidly enough is a bit of a challenge. Looking at what John's up to with his I wonder if I shouldn't change scales

Tony

Edited May 13, 2016 by TheBaron

[The Spadgent]

I don't envy you. I'm going cross eyed with my PE so you must have some kind of bionic eye!

[TheBaron]

I don't envy you. I'm going cross eyed with my PE so you must have some kind of bionic eye!

Almost! My minces ain't what they used to be so I just got one of these cheap off the S.American river online retailer. Now when I'm not modelling with it I can pretend to be a Cylon

[Martian]

Almost! My minces ain't what they used to be so I just got one of these cheap off the S.American river online retailer. Now when I'm not modelling with it I can pretend to be a Cylon

A few years ago I got my optician to make me up some X 8 magnification glasses tailored to my eyesight and then some X 13, I have never looked back since. They didn't even turn out anything like as expensive as I thought they would or maybe the optician gave me a good deal just to get this nutter out of her surgery?

Martin

[The Spadgent]

My word!!! It looks like a Tomy tronic. Brilliant.

[TheBaron]

A quick afternoon update...

You can see the joystick problem - it's enormous! Both that and the grey plastic frame in the pilot's area need some replacements scratching up.

I've tidied up the framing around the observer's radar console and added rear bulkheads behind the front and rear cockpits. I've also glued on the etching interior walls. This will come back to haunt me in a moment...

Once the bulkheads had set I was able to attach a framework to them behind each seat, which secures the shoulder straps for pilot and observer.

And then I had to address my earlier mistake that stever219 pointed out last night - I'd glued the etch interiors to follow the interior curvature of the fuselage, when of course, it should be nearly vertical down each side to create the cockpit 'box'

Having peeled each panel off and straightened them back out again, a precautionary test fit reveals a big problem. The rear cockpit seems fine, however the front etchings in their vertical form don't fit in two dimensions

Vertically the port one protrudes up above the cockpit sill, and horizontally, when positioning it with the elevator trim wheel and map case in their correct orientation to the seat, it jams up against the IP. The starboard one suffers a similar mismatch to the available space.

I'm prepared to admit I'm not the sharpest tool in the box when it comes to such things but at the moment it looks like I need to trim down the front cockpit interiors and sacrifice detail for fit.

I'm off to mow the lawn and to have a think before I come back and start slicing. If anyone has a more graceful solution, I'd be all ears...

Tony

Post lawn-cutting update:

A bit of stoical musing whilst manicuring the sward and a cunning Blackadder-ish plan to address the photo-etch problem. If I fix some 1mm plasticard strips to the join between the cockpit floor and the fuselage walls, then this should keep the lower edge of the photo-etch proud enough of the walls to be agle to glue them in a (correct) near-vertical orientation.

I suspect this will work fine for the rear pit, but am fairly certain there is a definite size problem with the front pit etching - it simply sticks up far too high for the vertical dimensions of the cockpit sill. With some judicious swearing and trimming I hope to be able to get this in upright too though.

I'll post some pics of the process later this evening to give an idea of how successful this strategy proves....

Edited May 13, 2016 by TheBaron

[Martian]

You can see the joystick problem - it's enormous!

Either that or the kit is pleased to see you! Sorry mods I just couldn't resist that one.

Martin

[TheBaron]

Time to start marking up and cutting - faint hearts and all that....

I've just glued a single 1mm strip on either side of each pit - no need for anything fancier as they're solely there to keep the photo-etch vertical at the bottom - the etch will meet the upper fuselage at the sill.

A quick dry fit of front and back pits. It seems to be working

The rear two glued in place..

You'll notice from the butchery that the etch simply did not fit when you try to mate the upper to the lower fuselage. As well as cutting the edge I had to grind out the inside of the upper fuselage as well.

Snipping and grinding finally led to a result that could be called an honourable truce between myself and the plastic. Whilst the means aren't pretty, when finally mated up with the etch in place, most of the earlier unpleasantness is concealed by the upper fuselage.

The final stage tonight was a snort of primer:

The etch actually comes up really nicely, it's just a shame about the fit

I'll leave it at that now for tonight. I'll come in with fresh eyes in the morning and rub down any rough looking areas before moving on. The next big challenge is going to be knocking together a convincing radar unit for the nose. The lads on the NF.14 WS788 restoration at YAM are doing some amazing stuff here:

http://forum.keypublishing.com/showthread.php?137187-A-W-Meteor-NF-14-WS788-Restoration-Thread

There's a superb few shots of them fitting the nose which gives me all the info I need to build the interior areas mounting the radar. I urge you to check out their work.

I also need to scratch up the front half of the Derwent 9's; just enough to be visible through the intakes.

Beautiful evening here. The housemartins are out and the moon is up. Off to commune with the elements.

Thanks for reading. More over the weekend,

Tony

[The Spadgent]

The fit of that PE is insane. You would think they would try and get it the right size at least! you are breezing through any troubles though, and such a good job too. The primed version looks wonderful. Bravo.

John.

[Martian]

That looks fine with the primer in place.

Martin (doing his best to behave this time)

[TheBaron]

Thanks Martin. I'll do my best to leave you plenty of opportunities for a pun or two. Fnarr fnarr etc.

[TheBaron]

Just a quick update today. The weather is sublime and my excuses for not tending the garden have run out so will be getting little bench time in later.

I realized talking with John yesterday that I'd forgotten the need for a nose weight - you can tell I don't build too many tricycle undercarriages...Luckily I have a decent collection of weights from my (stalled) fishing activities:

A bit sliced off a barrel weight and mashed into shape on the vice should do it. I'll have to put it in the front of this part of the nose as with sticking a radar in the main cone isn't going to leave sufficient room I don't think.

Having PE airbrakes in the Airwaves set requires some further cosmetic Dremel work (actually it is a cheap Chinese clone, not a proper Dremel, but works faithfully). I'd dithered over whether to cut out the brake areas or to grind them down to fit the etch. To misquote the Kurgan from 'Highlander' - 'It's better to cut out than to grind away':

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-bOKsOveYD0

Crude at present but some file and razor saw attention later should sort this lot out. I'm going to put some plasticard under the respective holes to inset the etch onto.

I managed to rub some Scotch Bonnet into my eyes whilst making chilli earlier so am off to give my reddened eyes another rinse under the tap. I currently look like a distraught hedge fund manager having to forgo a bonus

Tony

[Tomoshenko]

Very nice indeed, especially with a coat of primer. Framing looks good too. Shaping up to be a proper build. Eyes and chilli are not a good mix though. I vouch from personal experience. Yoghurt is said to mellow the fire, but wouldn't rub yoghurt in my eye. Oh well plenty of beer (drunk not rubbed in eyes). Won't get rid of the burning, but enough of it and you won't care...

[The Spadgent]

Ooh look at you wantely cutting holes in your wings like there's no tomorrow.

Here's me dithering about wether to take the plunge or not and BAM there you are with holes.

It looks like my bench time today will be zero. I've had a house to paint, dang houses. But I might get to scribe a little tomorrow morning.

Or should I do holes?????

Great progress btw. That weight is MaHooSive!!

Jont.

[TheBaron]

Tomo: Thanks for that. Beer as medicine it is!

John: Don't be weathering the house by mistake...

Edited May 14, 2016 by TheBaron

[TheBaron]

Looking back at this thread I realize I've probably been guilty of making my posts too pic-heavy for an aircraft that's already been built umpteen times. I'll try and keep the posts a bit lighter on visual content from now on and just focus on the bits that seem significant for somebody else deciding to build the aircraft, rather than every little detail.

If I seem a bit negative this morning it's because I went to bed last night having made a scrofulating nebcruddly of the airbrake installation. My 'common sense' approach didn't take into account the extra depth that plasticard insets would add, stopping the mating of lower to upper wings

I think I've got a solution sorted to that now and will post a (modest) update later, once the glue's had a chance to cure.

PS. Just re-reading David Edgerton's 'England and the Aeroplane' book last night. Hard to believe that there were so many aircraft companies in the UK at one stage!

Tony

Edited May 15, 2016 by TheBaron

[toms111s]

I don't think that your posts are picture heavy. I like seeing the progress your making.

[TheBaron]

I don't think that your posts are picture heavy. I like seeing the progress your making.

That's kind of you to say so sir

You can see the problems I'd alluded to earlier in the airbrake areas. Like an eejit I'd cut out the original mouldings and added some plasticard below. Bad idea. For two reasons. The first you've already noticed yourself is that the trench this left is far too deep for thin photo-etch. The second is this:

I've now added enough extra depth to the upper and lower wing profiles to make it impossible to mate the two halves. I ask you...

The way round this entirely self-created dilemma seemed to be to cut the plastic card to the exact size of the airbrake opening and glue it in just below the level of the wing, so that the etch airbrakes can be positioned at the correct level this time:

I've a little filling and sanding to do around the hinges but overall this is a much better job than my previous fumbling. I've angled the brakes slightly so that the hinges are flush but that the rear edge of them is slightly proud in order to give a sense of depth, like this one from WS7888 at YAM:

The Tomahawk is my youngest son's first-ever attempt at airbrushing a model. He's 11 and dead-chuffed with it. Does anyone know of a reputable forum for younger modellers online anywhere?

Regards to all,

Tony

Edited May 15, 2016 by TheBaron