Eduard 1/48 DR 1 paint question

[Bob Henry]

I am currently preparing the Eduard 1/48 DR-1 Dual Combo. I noticed that all decal versions require the same basic paint application. I must admit that I am totally clueless as to how to apply the streaked finish. It looks like the original full scale had a brushed on streaked finish so this would eliminate using an air brush. Has anyone built this kit and how do you apply the paint ? Also what paint do you use and what colors ? Any guidance would be appreciated. Thanks. Bob H.

[JackG]

You are right, the actual application was done by brush. There are decals mimicking the look, though this method might be more easier than for some.

I have seen it done by paint brush with varying success. Keep in mind though, that essentially you are trying to capture the effect of a scaled down brush. At most maybe 8 inches, scaled at 1/48 is about 4mm wide brush strokes - no easy task.

Here is my quick run down after reading other forums on how it was done way back when:

... have spent more than a few nights reading some of the plethora of threads at the Aerodrome forum on Fokker streaking. There is a lot written there, much discussion and sometimes very hotly debated opinions.

Of what is certain is the streaking was applied by hand brush at the factory. Some have suggested an 8 inch wide brush, but I forget how they came to this conclusion. There is a photo from a factory of a worker with a number of Fokker wings on a rack, drying perhaps. There seems to be a conscious effort that the applied wing surface streaking was at an angle of about one to one and one half ribs apart.

What is hotly debated is the surface colour before applied streaking. Most seem to be of the opinion it was either plain or treated canvas (but not coloured).

The colour of the streaking is another proverbially can of worms. There are three proposed methods I have read about.
The simplest is the olive(?) was stroked on with a back and forth motion till the paint ran out, then the brush was reloaded and contined from the last applied stroke.
Second method was to have three buckets of the same paint colour, but each one was thinned more than the previous.
Thirdly, there was two or even three colours of paint used.

regards,

Jack

[Tony Edmundson]

I used Fokker Olive Green(Polly S) over Tamiya Deck Tan on this. Excuse the yellow incandesant lighting. I sprayed the Deck Tan with Future before streaking the Olive Green with a 1/8" wide brush.

HTH , Tony

Edited March 2, 2016 by Tony Edmundson

[wyverns4]

Hi Bob,

I did mine using a base coat of a linen colour, (I forget which), which was then Kleared and then applied the streaking using well thinned olive green paint, (IIRC Polly Scale) and a 4mm flat brush. I took a while but looked the part when finished. Remember practice first, as me how I know...

Christian, exiled to africa

Edited March 2, 2016 by wyverns4

[Hotel Papa]

Also, that's the time to dig out the almost forgotten dry brush technique. (Does this even work with acrylics?) Wipe the brush almost dry on a paper towel, so it takes some pressure to even leave a slight trace on the base paint. Work in layers.

[Beardie]

I opted for a very pale blue as the base colour as I found this marked out in a thread by Dan San Abbot as having been found in careful research of surviving material at the IWM by an engineer Paul S. Leaman and this was a colour that was very frequently used on WWI German aircraft so it would seem to me to make sense using this as a starting point on the upper sides. On the whole the Germans seemed to utilise pale blue or lozenge patterend linnen on most of their aircraft and don't really seem to have been fans of clear doped linnen. Once this was done I then took a sizeable drop of matt clear enamel and added a drop or two of a couple of different olivey shades and gave them a swirl (by no means a mix). I then took a 'comb' brush and very sparingly took a little of the loose mix at a time onto the 'combs' and swept it downwards over the light blue building up the streaks and making sure that whatever angle you brush at is maintained throughout

A comb brush is like a regular flat paintbrush but has a mix of longer and shorter hairs so that you don't present a solid brush to the surface. It only works though if you are very light and only bring the longer hairs into contact with the surface and they are not heavily loaded with paint.

[JackG]

Here is the period photo mentioned:

Another interesting one of how a stencil is used to create national markings:

regards,

Jack

[Beardie]

Not quite how you imagine production during WWI. I count eighteen (albatros D.V?) upper wings in that stack. Would it not be easier to apply the stencil with the wing on a trestle? In the other picture it appears that one chap is working on the undersides with one paint pot while the other is doing the upper sides with four paint pots. I wonder if it was done with different blends of olive green/brown and base colour. I note that each pot has it's own brush, would you need that if they were only differently thinned versions of the same colour?

[Viking]

Great photos Jack!

I use oil paints over a base coat of Citadel 'Catachan Green' (which has been renamed 'Deathworld forest' and unfortunately made darker), but any grey/green would do. RLM 02 might be good.

Some explanation posted elsewhere in Britmodeller Here

And 2 of my Eduard 1/48 DR.1s using the technique.

HTH,

John

[Tony Edmundson]

Here's a bit of fun: http://www.aeroscale.co.uk/modules.php?op=modload&name=SquawkBox&file=index&req=viewtopic&topic_id=117346&page=1

[Bob Henry]

WOW !! I really appreciate all of the responses. I learned a lot. Based on the information it looks like I have two choices for a base color #1 - some form of plain doped linen or #2 - a pale light blue. Then I will spray a flat clear because I will most likely be utilizing the dry brushing technique. I normally use Testors Model Master enamels but the Vallejo acrylics work better for dry brushing. Does anyone know which Vallejo acrylic is closest to Fokker Olive ? Please let me know. Also based on the earlier posted photo it looks like I'll try to vary the olive just a bit by mixing in some yellow ... just enough to vary the olive shade a little. I am grateful to all of those who took the time to share additional information. In the meantime I'll be anxiously waiting to hear which Vallejo acrylic to use for the Fokker olive. Thanks again ... Bob H.

[wyverns4]

IIRC I used Vallejo Model Colour 887 Brown Violet, (linked to FS34087), No. 93 in the complete display.

Christian, exiled to africa

[The original Kit Builder]

I have always used an unbleached linen base colour, streaked with Tamiya olive drab on DR1's, based on the understanding of some of Dan Abbot's work.

For Voss' F1 I used a pale grey base, as I read that the F1 may have been covered in bleached linen. Once streaked, the effect is of a notably olive and blue streaked look, as reported by members of 56 Sqn after the combat in which Voss was killed.

[Bob Henry]

IIRC I used Vallejo Model Colour 887 Brown Violet, (linked to FS34087), No. 93 in the complete display.

Christian, exiled to africa

I purchased this paint yesterday. The actual link is FS34088. I plan on varying the streaks with a drop or two of light yellow mixed in here and there. I may try to build these for my next project. If I do I will definitely need everyone's help. Bob H.

[wyverns4]

Sound's like a plan!

Looking forward to your WIP and always happy to help!

Christian, exiled to the dark place

[Twobad]

A bit late to the party on this one and possibly post eventum. However I'm the process of building Hasegawa's 1:8 Scale Museum Series Dr.1 and have been doing a degree of research into the aircraft in support of that.

Both the Windsock Datafile Special "Fokker Dr.1 Jagdstaffeln" by Greg Van Wyngarden (1) and the Triplane Bible "Fokker Dr.1 - A World War One Legend" by Paul Leaman (2), state that the standard factory finish of the Dr.1s had three coats.

The first coat was a clear dope. The second coat was a light blue on the undersides and a thinned olive green (1)/ khaki-brown (2) on the upper sides. On top of that was a linseed oil varnish.

From the Paul Leaman book:

"The second coat of dope used on the uppersurfaces was a thinly mixed 'wash' in which a khaki-brown pigment was added sparingly. This was brushed on by hand with long, straight brush strokes at consistent angles which depended upon the surface being painted. Because the pigmented dope was thinly mixed and because the pressure on the brush being used was firm, there was a tendency for the brush bristles to separate and for the resulting finish to appear streaked with dense streaks of colour giving way to thinner-coloured streaks*. The uppersurfaces of the wings were painted with strokes running at approximately 10 degrees angle to the chord and the tailplane with strokes at approximately 20 degrees angle to its chord. The fuselage sides were painted with 'vertical' strokes and the fuselage decking had strokes at approximately 45 degrees to its centre line. It should be noted that as all triplane components were hand painted this 'streaking' varied from one machine to another. This variation provides a useful tool in the identification of individual machines from one photograph to another, when serial numbers are not visible."

* He goes on to elaborate in the end of chapter notes that the second reason for the streaking fading out in bands was due to "use of the brush without frequent replenishment of dope".

Paul Leaman's comments are based on an analysis of some fabric taken from Dr.1 144/17 which were analysed in 1969. He also states, as does Van Wyngarden, that the brushes used were 8cm wide, not 8".

Finally, the 1969 report gave the colours of the analysed fabric as:

Underside - 25C5 'turquoise green'

Upper surface varying from 4F5/6 or 4F8 olive brown in the dark areas to 3/D8 olive in the thin areas.

The colour definitions being taken from the Methuen Handbook of Colour.

These's also a lot more about dope thickness (oz/sqr yd) thread count in the linen etc. It's a VERY thorough book!

[Bob Henry]

A bit late to the party on this one and possibly post eventum. However I'm the process of building Hasegawa's 1:8 Scale Museum Series Dr.1 and have been doing a degree of research into the aircraft in support of that.

Both the Windsock Datafile Special "Fokker Dr.1 Jagdstaffeln" by Greg Van Wyngarden (1) and the Triplane Bible "Fokker Dr.1 - A World War One Legend" by Paul Leaman (2), state that the standard factory finish of the Dr.1s had three coats.

The first coat was a clear dope. The second coat was a light blue on the undersides and a thinned olive green (1)/ khaki-brown (2) on the upper sides. On top of that was a linseed oil varnish.

From the Paul Leaman book:

"The second coat of dope used on the uppersurfaces was a thinly mixed 'wash' in which a khaki-brown pigment was added sparingly. This was brushed on by hand with long, straight brush strokes at consistent angles which depended upon the surface being painted. Because the pigmented dope was thinly mixed and because the pressure on the brush being used was firm, there was a tendency for the brush bristles to separate and for the resulting finish to appear streaked with dense streaks of colour giving way to thinner-coloured streaks*. The uppersurfaces of the wings were painted with strokes running at approximately 10 degrees angle to the chord and the tailplane with strokes at approximately 20 degrees angle to its chord. The fuselage sides were painted with 'vertical' strokes and the fuselage decking had strokes at approximately 45 degrees to its centre line. It should be noted that as all triplane components were hand painted this 'streaking' varied from one machine to another. This variation provides a useful tool in the identification of individual machines from one photograph to another, when serial numbers are not visible."

* He goes on to elaborate in the end of chapter notes that the second reason for the streaking fading out in bands was due to "use of the brush without frequent replenishment of dope".

Paul Leaman's comments are based on an analysis of some fabric taken from Dr.1 144/17 which were analysed in 1969. He also states, as does Van Wyngarden, that the brushes used were 8cm wide, not 8".

Finally, the 1969 report gave the colours of the analysed fabric as:

Underside - 25C5 'turquoise green'

Upper surface varying from 4F5/6 or 4F8 olive brown in the dark areas to 3/D8 olive in the thin areas.

The colour definitions being taken from the Methuen Handbook of Colour.

These's also a lot more about dope thickness (oz/sqr yd) thread count in the linen etc. It's a VERY thorough book!

Thank you very much. You are definitely not too late. I am curious about one thing that was mentioned in your post. The first coat was clear dope applied to the linen ( fabric ). I am wondering if that linen ( fabric ) was bleached, which would have made it turn color to a very pale grey with a slight blue tint. This was mentioned in the previous discussion. Just curious. Bob H.

[wyverns4]

Hi Bob,

Are you referring to #13? if so this mentions the finish applied to the F.I and not the Dr.I. The F.I essentially was the precursor of the Dr.I and along with some structural variation, the finish also differed slightly.

Christian, exiled to africa

[Twobad]

Thank you very much. You are definitely not too late. I am curious about one thing that was mentioned in your post. The first coat was clear dope applied to the linen ( fabric ). I am wondering if that linen ( fabric ) was bleached, which would have made it turn color to a very pale grey with a slight blue tint. This was mentioned in the previous discussion. Just curious. Bob H.

From Paul Leaman's endnotes on Factory Finish:

"The [1969] report stated that the samples had been finished by calendaring or beetling, and were probably spun from chemically treated flax fibre, thus reducing ordinary retted filaments to ultimately, the fibre of a single cell, possibly to be of a coarser grade of flax for finer yarns than was obtainable with ordinary retting.

It has to be stressed that this sample of lightweight linen fabric was taken from one particular triplane, and that it is likely that in production both quality and weight of the material would have varied from batch to batch of aircraft, depending upon availability at the time of manufacture."

I hope that goes some way to answering your question. The book doesn't specifically mention bleaching anywhere that I can see.

However, the linseed oil varnish would also have had a very light pigmentation which would have added a slight golden hint to everything.

[Bob Henry]

Thanks again for the additional info. Now I know how to proceed. Bob H.

[Bob Henry]

OK .. Now I've officially decided to take the plunge and attempt my first WWI aircraft .... the Eduard 1/48 DR1 dual combo as mentioned above. I know that some of you will be able to advise me on the next painting question. What are some of your preferred techniques for painting wood grain on what is supposed to be a plywood surface ? I'm guessing some sort of wood tan base color and I'm totally clueless as to how to apply a darker brown color to simulate the wood grain. Can you offer any "Divine Guidance" ? Thanks. Bob H.

[melvyn hiscock]

That would only apply to the internals, the plywood is fairings under the fabric

[melvyn hiscock]

There is no plywood showing externally and you need to ask if you would even see grain in 1/48. Get a piece of ply and plate if 12ft (3in in scale) away and you will see very little grain. Here are some photos that might help

You can see on these you cannot see grain on the inside plywood and these were taken from about 2ft away. I have added on some other details because I am in an unusually generous mood!

Melvyn Hiscock

Edited March 28, 2016 by melvyn hiscock

[JackG]

As Melvyn stated, wood surfaces on a DR 1 are mostly found interior, other than the tail skid and propeller - though the method used to create wood grain is not the best for capturing the look of laminated layers.

Your guess is correct, a base acrylic paint colour of tan or sand is the first stage. Once dry, the next step is applied, the preferred choice of paint is oil based in some shade of brown. I believe some use just one brush to apply strokes in the direction of the grain until satisfied. Others might go in with a dampened clean brush to remove some of the paint while creating the grain.

regards,

Jack

,

[Twobad]

I'll start by saying that fake woodgrain isn't one of my best skills, so consider this as a 'how I did it' rather than a definitive 'how to...'

As mentioned above I use a base colour with artist's oils on top. The colours used depend on the finish and type of wood you want to simulate. An acrylic base is probably best but you can get away with enamel provided it is well dried and you don't mess about with the oils too long. Finish is key though. The oils will excentuate any imperfections in the base coat surface.

Below is a pic of tailskid I did recently (1:8 scale). I wanted a warm finish with a fine grain so I used a mid brown (matt enamel) base with Burnt Sienna oil on top. Then I varnished it with yacht varnish. The ultra gloss finish will calm down with time.

I coated the surface evenly with the oil paint first, then dragged a relatively stiff and coarse brush across the surface. The strength and fineness of the grain can be adjusted depending on the pressure used (pretty light in this instance).

Practice on some gash bits of sprue or plasticard until you get a feel for it would be my main advice.

This is a Camel I made recently (also 1:8). The cabane strut is real wood and the prop on the Rotherham pump was done with the technique described above.

Edited March 29, 2016 by Twobad