CrazyCrank Posted October 16, 2016 Share Posted October 16, 2016 32 minutes ago, sharknose156 said: Dear Olivier, IMHO there is no tube holding the ignition wires on the 806. For several reasons, but here i will be brief: The Mef has a tube holding the wires because it is a very long (!) straight 6 cylinder 21.7 lit. engine designed in 1908/1909. Therefore the electric cables linked to the cylinders had to be long, and protected from the steel cylinders heat etc. at the time i am pretty sure the rubber or silk coated cables were very sensitive to heat and could melt or burn. Eldridge kept the the A12 engine as it was originally when he ran the car in 1924. The 806 racer's engine belongs to the 1.5 litre generation of smaller turbocharged compact motors with the cylinders divided in two parallel lines. The engine's electric cables in 27 were better insulated etc. and most probably needed NOT be protected in a copper tube which would have added weight and taken space under the hood of these little mean racers. I looked at some photos of same generation engines ; maserati, delage, bugatti and they all seemed to have had their cables exposed. Neatly packed but exposed. Dear Sam, you are probably right with your explanation for the Mef'. For the 806 Corsa, unfortunately, nobody knows, and your explanation,although it's quite logical, seems questionable, with all due respect Indeed, If you are probably right concerning the better insulation of cables, I have to remember you that on the T 50 Bugatti, for instance, issued in 1932, there was a loom for ignition cables...and we can suppose the ignition wires were as well insulated in 1932 than in 1927... Furthermore, iginition wires for this Bug were silk coated, if i'm not mistaken (contrary to what show a lot of reference and Net-found pictures of some resurrected Bugs')... Other Buggatis that suggest what I say: T35B Bugatti, 1924, race car By DK58 - Renaud — http://www.flickr.com/photos/dk58888/4262185087/, CC BY 2.0, https://commons.wikimedia.org/w/index.php?curid=11515922 T37 Bugatti, 1926 to 1930, race car T43, 1927 From "Bugatti" by Fabien Sabatès, Ch. Massin Edition T50 Bugatti, 1932 T57S, 1934 From "Bugatti" by Fabien Sabatès, Ch. Massin Edition And I can show you numerous pictures of youngest cars, as a Talbot Lago Grand Sport T26 of 1949, that have silk coated ignition wires and a loom ... How do we know with certitude how many of them were, when they leaved factory, and before any restoration, that often flout the historic reality, many decades later ! Well, it's a fruitless debate... Even a Museum entirely dedicated to this 806 Corsa will not be going to complain with these probably unperfect but very realistic models, IMHO. Friendly CC 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Totally Mad Olivier Posted October 17, 2016 Share Posted October 17, 2016 Thanks so much CC for this very documented answer, I am always impressed by your knowledge on classic cars! Nice photos, more... As you say, I think we have done all what we could, so now, the debate is closed concerning me, as mentioned above. Very friendly Olivier Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sharknose156 Posted October 17, 2016 Share Posted October 17, 2016 Dear Thierry, Yes i see that you are right. i hope i can find out more info via Turino or via Motor Sport Magazine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Little Andi Posted October 19, 2016 Author Share Posted October 19, 2016 Hi all ...... Olivier has been asking about the HT lead connectors on my 806. Well, nothing special going on here but having replied in writing thought it might help with a pic' to illustrate same. An obvious, and merciless enlargement - but basically "Brass tube (1.1mm), crimped and then the flat is drilled (.75) - a nice arc is filled around the hole and then with a short tail cut off. Not sure of the internal diameter but it comfortably takes a 0.35mm wire the sleeve of which is 0.75 ..... (telephone wire). That's it for now - in the process of mounting the axle assemblies at the minute - not difficult but of course, everything has to be "stitched" together visually now, and it is a bit time consuming as I immediately forget how I achieved whatever effect it is I'm trying to duplicate! 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Totally Mad Olivier Posted October 19, 2016 Share Posted October 19, 2016 Hello guys, hello John, I got today John (VT)'s resin Protar tyres and they are great. Thank you John for that amazing work! John had the good idea to place the join in order it not to be visible (not in the middle of the tread). This is very important to avoid losing details on this tread The try showed just the need for a little sanding on the inside, but the adjustment is excellent. My strategy of painting for these tyres: I began the paint work by applying a mix of XF1 (90%) and XF2 (10%) thinned with X20A. After drying, I will apply a Marabu satin varnish (enamel varnish) on the whole tyre (thinned with X20 Tamiya) and, after drying, a wash with flat black enamel in the hollows and around the inscriptions, to finish with a drybrush with flat medium/dark grey on the treads and the inscriptions. Suggestions? Thank you again John, it would have been a pity to mount the Mef tyres after the big work that was respoking the 4 wheels... Definitely, I love the spirit of this forum and this thread: sharing solutions, sharing hints, sharing our passion! All the best Olivier 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Totally Mad Olivier Posted October 19, 2016 Share Posted October 19, 2016 P.S: Having a look at that wheel, I am thinking white wash (instead of black) around the inscriptions should be a better idea... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vontrips Posted October 19, 2016 Share Posted October 19, 2016 Glad you like them Olivier and happy that they fit! Yes, I'd go for a light dusty earth wash around the lettering and maybe in the deep tread areas too? John 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sharknose156 Posted October 19, 2016 Share Posted October 19, 2016 (edited) @Little Andi your electric cables look great, they also look like spaghetti ... the mef. ( sorry to bring this car again) had the same spaghetti weathered / sauce stained yellow cables. @Olivier de St Raph great work mon ami ! yes a white wash will give you more contrast imho @vontrips Von Smallhausen, your tyres are amazing... i will also place an order ! Great spirit here ! Edited October 19, 2016 by sharknose156 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Totally Mad Olivier Posted October 20, 2016 Share Posted October 20, 2016 Hello guys, I have a question for all of you: in the same time I "work" (I should say have fun) on VT's tyres, i am on the steering wheel (will post soon on this too). The question is about the clear part 1CF on the 15th step. I wonder if this clear part did exist on the real car. It does not appear on the plans and the Mef hasn't got it. it's certainly not glass and if the plexiglas had been ever invented (end of 19th), I don't see the interest of such a piece on a race car.I wonder if it is not a Protar's creation (it is on the Protar's instructions too). Look forward to have your opinions about that... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Totally Mad Olivier Posted October 20, 2016 Share Posted October 20, 2016 Ok, I bring myself a first answer to my own question: I didn't notice that on the Bordino's picture (should we say photo?). Definitely, on this, there is a sort of clear frame (is it so clear? looks a bit cloudy, no?). It seems anyway much less thick as 1CF. Waiting for your comments... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Little Andi Posted October 20, 2016 Author Share Posted October 20, 2016 I think a general wisdom is that this is a guard to help deflect hot oil mist away from the driver's face ... for what it's worth mine will not feature this. It is probably a Cellulose acetate sheet, the material of which had been around since the mid' 1800's. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrazyCrank Posted October 20, 2016 Share Posted October 20, 2016 9 minutes ago, Little Andi said: I think a general wisdom is that this is a guard to help deflect hot oil mist away from the driver's face ... for what it's worth mine will not feature this. It is probably a Cellulose acetate sheet, the material of which had been around since the mid' 1800's. When I saw Olivier's question, my first reaction was to joke, doing this answer " to prevent oil projections on his white coverall", and I held back, because we are members of a very serious forum But really, I thought it was a guard to protect the driver. Andi, your explanation for this part is very convincing. Its transparency allows ,the drivers to see dashboard instruments. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Totally Mad Olivier Posted October 20, 2016 Share Posted October 20, 2016 Ok, thank you both. Andi, did I understand well, you will not use this clear part? So, for you, Thierry, the sheet is clear so that the pilot may see dashboard instruments. Ok, while it does n't seem to be so clear on the picture... This very interesting doc shows also: - very small rivets on the body - very thin rods for the 54E part (I wonder if I work on it to get a thinner or if I make a scratch part) - even if we can't see it well (pity...), the round part in the middle of the steering wheel (64E) seems to be very thin too. This is confirmed by the pictures on plans (top view and lateral view) and so, I absolutely agree with VT, to say this part is wrong (and ugly, IMHO) on the kit. Pity, I can't make it like VT (neither the stuff, neither the skills...) but I'll try to do my best with what I have.I began to file it seriously, and I'll go on with plastic card or acetate sheet... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Totally Mad Olivier Posted October 20, 2016 Share Posted October 20, 2016 P.S: I've changed my mind about the painting strategy mentionned above: I will apply the varnish after the end of the weathering, so that I will be able to make corrections on my work (weathering too strong, fe) and to avoid pbs with the varnish when doing the drybrush... I made photos of my car's tyres to take inspiration for this work to come... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrazyCrank Posted October 20, 2016 Share Posted October 20, 2016 1 hour ago, Olivier de St Raph said: Ok, thank you both. Andi, did I understand well, you will not use this clear part? So, for you, Thierry, the sheet is clear so that the pilot may see dashboard instruments. Ok, while it does n't seem to be so clear on the picture... This very interesting doc shows also: - very small rivets on the body - very thin rods for the 54E part (I wonder if I work on it to get a thinner or if I make a scratch part) - even if we can't see it well (pity...), the round part in the middle of the steering wheel (64E) seems to be very thin too. This is confirmed by the pictures on plans (top view and lateral view) and so, I absolutely agree with VT, to say this part is wrong (and ugly, IMHO) on the kit. Pity, I can't make it like VT (neither the stuff, neither the skills...) but I'll try to do my best with what I have.I began to file it seriously, and I'll go on with plastic card or acetate sheet... This sheet is clear...it's situated forward the steering wheel, whose branches are visible through it, so...... So, if it doesn't seem so clear, it's due, IMHO, to a picture artifact. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vontrips Posted October 20, 2016 Share Posted October 20, 2016 23 minutes ago, CrazyCrank said: This sheet is clear...it's situated forward the steering wheel, whose branches are visible through it, so...... So, if it doesn't seem so clear, it's due, IMHO, to a picture artifact. Or, oil mist! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrazyCrank Posted October 20, 2016 Share Posted October 20, 2016 Of course ! you're right Vontrips ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Totally Mad Olivier Posted October 20, 2016 Share Posted October 20, 2016 Ok guys. I agree with your answers, and it's probably oil mist because if you have an accurate look at the picture, you can see through the steering wheel, but not as well as if the sheet was clear and neat. The question for me now is to decide if I use the Italeri's part or if I make one thinner from Evergreen clear card... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrazyCrank Posted October 20, 2016 Share Posted October 20, 2016 Olivier, you can use Rhodoïd sheet (cellulose acetate) of 25/100 thick for instance, that is 3.00 mm thick à 1:1 scale. You can find them in creative hobbies shops. You can also use rhodoïd sheets for overhead projectors, there are of various thickness and they will be cheaper... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Banny Posted October 20, 2016 Share Posted October 20, 2016 I actually used some clear acetate(?) from a chocolate box! Can't get cheaper than that! (Except the chocolates were quite expensive). John Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vontrips Posted October 20, 2016 Share Posted October 20, 2016 (edited) 1 hour ago, Olivier de St Raph said: Ok guys. I agree with your answers, and it's probably oil mist because if you have an accurate look at the picture, you can see through the steering wheel, but not as well as if the sheet was clear and neat. The question for me now is to decide if I use the Italeri's part or if I make one thinner from Evergreen clear card... I'm playing Devil's advocate here, but also bare in mind the background of the photo was probably airbrushed out with white gouache to highlight the silhouette of the car. They probably didn't airbrush behind the clear part and the original background could have been darker! ;-) The film is misty though as the edge of the cockpit is soft. Edited October 20, 2016 by vontrips Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Totally Mad Olivier Posted October 20, 2016 Share Posted October 20, 2016 In fact, I reviewed the 1CF clear part and I must admit I was too severe about its thickness: it is 0,25 mm which is good. Following VT point of view (just above), I will let the part clear. Sorry for the disturb... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Totally Mad Olivier Posted October 20, 2016 Share Posted October 20, 2016 Hi guys, here is the first photo of my re-spoked wheels associated to "Protar/ VT" tyres. I made a light weathering cause I place in the time my 806 a few days before the race, so the tyres are in quite good condition. Any suggestion welcome... Good evening to all 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vontrips Posted October 20, 2016 Share Posted October 20, 2016 Wow Olivier, first time I've actually seen them in the proper black! I have to say they look amazing with your fantastic respoked wheels. I'm inspired enough to dust my kit down again! John 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Totally Mad Olivier Posted October 20, 2016 Share Posted October 20, 2016 ... and here is the steering wheel. I modified a lot 64E and used hexagonal RP Toolz to make the nuts, with 0,8 mm plastic card, then painted brass. The 1CF clear part (not modified) was cemented on the frame 54E with double sided tape (from Aventador Pocher but available separately). I used 1mm Jammydog masking tape instead of 2mm leather suggested in the instructions to make the strip on the wheel rim. Satin black Revell on it. Alclad chrome on a gloss black base for 54E, 64E and 4F. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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