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Fiat 806 -"Gangshow"- build album.


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A couple of three pic's to bring us up to date, and topical seeing as we were discussing hinges? My solution was a simple as, just gluing some thin brass tube along the edge of the bonnet and shoving a bit of florists wire up the middle - tadah!!

Actually it was a bit more fiddly than that, and I ended up jiggering it up at one point which is why it doesn't look as neat as I'd like. But, I've engineered in reasons for rough workmanship with my backstory so I'm covered (see you all thought I was being daft didn't you - (there was moth-ed in my medness).

806-37_zps2svckqxw.jpg

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806-39_zps5jlfkpan.jpg

Oh, and I opened up the louvres too - it's a lot easier when you say it that quick!! ................. Actually it wasn't hard it was just really tedious, but it's done now, including the odd repair, no doubt it will need a bit of fettling when I get the primer on it. You'll have to excuse the screw heads but I've just assembled the main parts to see if I've got any fit issues, and have in fact trimmed the bonnet here and there but by and large it goes together pretty well - also for the first time I/you can see just how purposeful this little beasty looks.

More as it happens ...................... cheers all.

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Nice work Andi! In the middle of photographing Rich's model and layering over the original shots in Photoshop. Is it the same...errr, no, but not as bad as I thought. Can't show pics until Tuesday and will try to match the shots better. Tricky as there's lens distortion on the seated driver shot. Undoubtedly, the original body is more slender and lower. To match the top profile makes the chassis about half it's height too low. Fuel filler needs to be 5mm further forward and so do the right rear louvres. Double bend in exhaust 10mm too far back (and handbrake too). Exhaust too deep in section and there's more curvature to the cockpit fairing. The bonnet line is about 4mm too high!

Will I accommodate these changes? Probably not! :)

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OK, so I couldn't live with the filler cap in the wrong place any longer! Jeweller's tip for repairing holes is never make them square as they catch the eye...ho hum!

IMAG3096_zpsmdypthkj.jpg

Too late for drilling new hole, so bed for me:

IMAG3098_zpsk3ooiryv.jpg

Masking tape indicates new louvre positions.

Edited by vontrips
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Andi

Simple solutions are always the way to go (especially for a simple soul like me). Having said that (I'm going to regret this), how about dividing the tube into small pieces and gluing them alternately onto both sides of the bonnet? That's not a suggestion aimed at you, more a rhetorical question.

I'm considering having a bash at doing a bit of resin casting (shock, horror). My thinking is that the plug caps and distributor need to be sorted, and a couple of other components have broken and need repair/replacement. Anyway, as I am a resin casting virgin

can you give me your opinion on this reasonably priced casting kit please?

http://www.mbfg.co.uk/category-186/polycraft-moulding-casting-resin-kit-small.html

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Andi

Simple solutions are always the way to go (especially for a simple soul like me). Having said that (I'm going to regret this), how about dividing the tube into small pieces and gluing them alternately onto both sides of the bonnet? That's not a suggestion aimed at you, more a rhetorical question.

I'm considering having a bash at doing a bit of resin casting (shock, horror). My thinking is that the plug caps and distributor need to be sorted, and a couple of other components have broken and need repair/replacement. Anyway, as I am a resin casting virgin

can you give me your opinion on this reasonably priced casting kit please?

http://www.mbfg.co.uk/category-186/polycraft-moulding-casting-resin-kit-small.html

Banny, I've already cast the distributor caps. Drop us an address and I'll get a couple off to you!

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Andi

Simple solutions are always the way to go (especially for a simple soul like me). Having said that (I'm going to regret this), how about dividing the tube into small pieces and gluing them alternately onto both sides of the bonnet? That's not a suggestion aimed at you, more a rhetorical question.

Sorry I was perhaps being a little too flippant - that is indeed exactly what I did ............... otherwise it wouldn't open and close (see first pic'). .... :winkgrin:

PS ................ when it comes to casting Vontrips your man ............... I tried it and I'm rubbish.

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Been having a very close look at the four period photos today. I have come to the conclusion the right-hand louvres are punched outwards and the left-hand louvres are punched inwards?!

Why, I don't know, but it's confirmed in both the two right side and left side shots - even though they've been touched up.

Any thoughts?

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Andi, what did you use to glue the brass tubes onto the hood? Did you reinforce the joints? I would think that constant opening and closing of the bonnet would weaken the plastic to brass joints?

Edited by Jnkm13
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Andi, what did you use to glue the brass tubes onto the hood? Did you reinforce the joints? I would think that constant opening and closing of the bonnet would weaken the plastic to brass joints?

Actually nothing that clever ... just "poundland" cyano' - pretty good stuff, and so cheap you can afford to replace it as soon as it starts to go stale and not grab immediately.

BUT, I did run a concave groove of sympathetic diameter the length of the bonnet, the brass was annealed with a flame and then scuffed up for some bite. To be honest when I cocked up a couple of times - (the cyano' wicked into the hinge - grr) it really took some getting off without completely trashing the whole assembly. Once it was proven and working I added several layers of glue over the top building up a fillet which I've since sanded back flush - I'm more worried about paint build-up now as it's a very fine little assembly.

Regards opening and closing, I went to great lengths to make sure it wasn't hinge-bound, and then lubricated it with some petroleum jelly, and to be honest it won't be "used" that often - probably posed for pic's and lifted off completely for full inspection. It has made a better job of it than I might of give it credit for when I started. Sometimes it's nice to know my thinking does pan out - it's not always the case.

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Been having a very close look at the four period photos today. I have come to the conclusion the right-hand louvres are punched outwards and the left-hand louvres are punched inwards?!

Any thoughts?

I'll tell you what my thoughts are - I'm not bliddy well changing them now - and that's a fact!!! ....................... :frantic::boom:

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I'll tell you what my thoughts are - I'm not bliddy well changing them now - and that's a fact!!! ....................... :frantic::boom:

Haha...thought you might say that! Just starting the first cut :S

I'm toying with sectioning 4mm of the bottom of the body too...argh!

Edited by vontrips
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Mmm, a very simple but elegant solution to the bonnet hinge problem. I too have worried about creating such a hinge arrangement and subsequently keeping the paint from locking it up!

I'm currently experimenting with some ally 'peel back lids' that I found at work (from large coffee cans) I think the gauge of this material will at least be strong enough for the louvres, they may also be used to create a bonnet hinge, just have to see if they are robust enough?

Love the petroleum jelly lubricant idea.

Superb stuff and real 'working on the knee' modelling. Strangely enough, I am looking forward more to seeing your completed model than my own :mental::coolio:

Steve.

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VT interesting your cockpit edge reshaping.

Have you come to a final conclusion on the length of the car since you are scrutinizing the pictures so well?

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VT interesting your cockpit edge reshaping.

Have you come to a final conclusion on the length of the car since you are scrutinizing the pictures so well?

Sam, not quite formulated the ideal solution, so I'm busking it bit by bit. I'm going to remove the bottom few mm's where the body mounts on the chassis rails which will make it look sleeker at least. Still thinking it through in case it creates other problems; eg. May have to lower grill and radiator ect. I will document each tweak though.

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Been having a very close look at the four period photos today. I have come to the conclusion the right-hand louvres are punched outwards and the left-hand louvres are punched inwards?!

Why, I don't know, but it's confirmed in both the two right side and left side shots - even though they've been touched up.

Any thoughts?

very much looking forward to see your superposed photos. Does not make technical sense to me.

May i dare venture an explanation for the asymmetry of the louvres on both sides ( this is your question right ?)

1) On the photo taken of the 806 on the starting line with the other two cars at Monza below, the louvres on top of the gas tank seem a bit deformed. Not only because of the quality of the pic. This photo was probably taken just before the start. meaning one day after it crashed. One can almost feel the tension before the start by looking at the body language of the people on the grid etc.

prewar-racing-197.jpg_1927_milan_gp_monz

Now, we know the car was almost totaled the day before, ( should be exactly one day before this picture was taken on the start line ), we also know the mechanics worked all night trying to put the car back together, and even required the help of the mechanics working on the Schneider trophy plane to finish in time..... so my hypothesis is perhaps they just hammered at the louvres and did not have time to doll them up and wrap them in silk paper, so we have this assymetry on both sides, one side flat open and the other facing north...

the overall body seems to be back in very good shape after the accident, i don t think Fiat would place a beaten car on the grid, but who would care about the alignement of 3 Louvres as long as the air can go through....

On the photo of Bordino posing at the wheel surrounded by people, one of them looking like Enzo Ferrari at the time (?) beside the Italian man in a Fascist uniform and cape of the time, we can see these same louvres clearly open facing forward. My guess this "relaxed" picture was taken before the Qualy trials, before the car crashed (crashed after taking pole).

bordino_monza3-27_zpsog3kbyqk.jpg

i tried to call inspector Columbo and inspector Clouseau and even Poirot, to see if anyone concurs, but no answer. :weep:

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Sam, I didn't know about the previous days accident! :S

They are the two shots I refered to previously. The second shot with Bordino facing camera I don't interpret the louvres sticking out at all! The view down the bodywork is very foreshortened - if the louvres stood proud of the body surface, they would be more evident than this?

Here's my badly photographed take on it. The recesses would be darker when I scale the wall thickness on all three louvres:

IMAG3110_zps5xocr38m.jpg

I'm pretty sure the tail louvres are also recessed! :)

Edited by vontrips
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Good grief man - how on earth, or rather "what" on earth are you using to make those piercings in the body shell - first the square, then the circle and now those radiused slots - they are are surgically accurate, and clean ... oh so clean.

Now I'll admit I wasn't going for super neat when I did mine but this makes me look like I did it with a pick and shovel. These look for all the world as though they've been done with computer controlled lasers .................. "have they"?

I know this isn't a competition, but looking at this level of work why I ask myself, am I bothering .................................. :shrug:

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Good grief man - how on earth, or rather "what" on earth are you using to make those piercings in the body shell - first the square, then the circle and now those radiused slots - they are are surgically accurate, and clean ... oh so clean.

Now I'll admit I wasn't going for super neat when I did mine but this makes me look like I did it with a pick and shovel. These look for all the world as though they've been done with computer controlled lasers .................. "have they"?

I know this isn't a competition, but looking at this level of work why I ask myself, am I bothering .................................. :shrug:

Don't be daft fella! I do a lot of this kind of stuff for my living...Can't help myself sometimes! Actually, I'm enjoying this part of the build as I love butchering kits! :)

Marked out using Dymo tape and a blade and then sawed out with a piercing saw. Cleaned up with my favourite tool, a 10a blade with various grades of wet and dry double-sided on. There's method in the smooth edges - I'll add the louvre bottoms underneath then spoon on filler with a round tool to get the profile..aha! :)

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I mean this in a good way, but any newbie following this thread might be put off permanently seeing how much work needs to be done to get this kit right.

He can of course take the easy way out and build ootb like I did, but what's the fun in that after seeing the work you guys are doing...

Really masterful work...

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VT aka "the butcher", Andi is right, really how did you get such precision? the circle and the louvres ends are perfect.

am also very impressed, how were you able to calculate that the gasoline filler was 5 mm more forward ? by superposing your friend's car picture at angle over the bordino pic ?

On the louvres you may be right, but my humble conclusion still tells me that at this angle of the camera, on the Bordino pic with the officers, if the louvres did not have very thin and small covers which openings by luck happen to be oriented towards the viewer, one may not have such a neat and dark impression. They would look more 'flat' like your perfect ones, less dark, even with bits of the body work showing in between perhaps. it is a question of perspective i guess.

Edited by sharknose156
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