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    • Mike

      PhotoBucket are no longer permitting 3rd party hosting   01/07/17

      As most of you are now painfully aware, Photobucket (PB) are stopping/have stopped allowing their members to link their accumulated years of photos into forums and the like, which they call 3rd party linking.  You can give them a non-refundable $399 a year to allow links, but I doubt that many will be rushing to take them up on that offer.  If you've previously paid them for the Pro account, it looks like you've got until your renewal to find another place to host your files, but you too will be subject to this ban unless you fork over a lot of cash.   PB seem to be making a concerted move to another type of customer, having been the butt of much displeasure over the years of a constantly worsening user interface, sloth and advertising pop-ups, with the result that they clearly don't give a hoot about the free members anymore.  If you don't have web space included in your internet package, you need to start looking for another photo host, but choose carefully, as some may follow suit and ditch their "free" members at some point.  The lesson there is keep local backups on your hard drive of everything you upload, so you can walk away if the same thing happens.   There's a thread on the subject here, so please use that to curse them, look for solutions or generall grouse about their mental capacity.   Not a nice situation for the forum users that hosted all their photos there, and there will now be a host of useless threads that relied heavily on photos from PB, but as there's not much we can do other than petition for a more equitable solution, I suggest we make the best of what we have and move on.  One thing is for certain.  It won't win them any friends, but they may not care at this point.    Mike.
vesthepes

L-29 SyAAF AMK 1:48

33 posts in this topic

Hello once again

Besides my freshly started Iraqi Hunter, I decided to post some build photos of this wonderful kit I started earlier - the AMK L-29

This is a special build for a friend, the author of the Luftwaffe A.S blog. That said you already know it's gonna be in livery of one of them rare Syrian birds. The plane was in NMF carrying the flag with the eagle of Saladin on the tail with nose and tail painted in red.

Besides some decals I also acquired the Eduard PE interior. But enough with the talk let's skip to the photos.

The AMK kit -highly recommended, excellent details, great fitting, smooth surface, hard plastic, some PE included, nice boxing...

IMG_20150219_143550.jpg

IMG_20150219_143801.jpg

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The aftermarket...

The only shortcoming of this PE set is the most common problem of all pre-painted Eduard sets and that is you can't switch the color. The Delfin's cockpit might also be grey, but judging by the photos of Syrian examples that could be blue too. So blue it is...

IMG_20150304_130910.jpg

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I enjoyed working with PE

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The structure behind the flaps is nicely detailed with the PE included in the kit

IMG_20150314_175344.jpg

The fitting of the kit is great and can be comparable to Tamiya models

IMG_20150311_172359.jpg

IMG_20150318_201422.jpg

more to come

cheers

Edited by vesthepes
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Part II

The fuselage halves are joined with minimal sanding and primed with Mr. Surfacer

IMG_20150330_220556.jpg

following with the shiny layer of black. I used Tamiya X-1 gloss black. I previously tried the Alclad's black primer but didn't like it due to weeks of waiting for the render to dry. This one is dry in 15min...

IMG_20150331_132723.jpg

IMG_20150331_132750.jpg

and my favorite metallic colors:

IMG_20150401_185533.jpg

here we go

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IMG_20150402_150812.jpg

IMG_20150402_151317.jpg

IMG_20150403_132630.jpg

...be back

cheers

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That's looking very impressive.

Never seen this kit before, but it looks excellent.

Karl

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Thanks Karl

Here's some more photos of the build

Some panels received a different shade of aluminium(flaps, ailerons, intakes, etc)..antiglare black in front of the windscreen, red nose and rudder..

IMG_20150407_145028.jpg

IMG_20150407_150752.jpg

I'll use the Linden Hill Iraqi Fighters set for the serials required. There are plenty so that shouldn't be a problem

IMG_20150407_144833.jpg

As for the roundels and flags I also had a few alternatives.

IMG_20150407_144337.jpg

IMG_20150407_144657.jpg

all the smaller bits painted...

IMG_20150407_145650.jpg

IMG_20150407_145658.jpg

cheers

Edited by vesthepes
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hi, nice project!

on the adequate flag, Tom Cooper might know a lot more, but you have to decide an a timeframe!

the eagle of Saladin or more likely the Hawk of Qureish was used only between 1972 and 1980

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coat_of_arms_of_Syria

during other times 2 or 3 green stars where used within the flag!

your decals show several eagles and hawks,

for Syria I would choose a gold one, maybe without the black outline... but I cant see the correct shape in your photos.. the gold-only ones look like eagle of Saladin

the ones labeled "F" seem to represent the Hawk of Qureish (where are they from?) and look very nice (although outlined black more likely to be used by Egypt)

hope that is of some help!

best regards, Werner

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Thanks Werner, I'm glad you like it.

As for the flag, it does represent the one from 72-80 period like you mentioned. The flag of Syria in the Federation of Arab Republics. As far as I know it is the same as the one of Egypt from that period (72-84). That means no stars on the flag or roundels.

The one labeled F are from Hi-Decal set for Su-7. For me it's kind of the best match, you're right maybe no black outline, but still...nicely detailed. The ones without the black outline are from Eduard's MiG-21 and look OK but are too big and the ones with the outline are from HAD decals intended for the Delfin but the Eagle looks strange...

As for the references I have no doubt, as I have photos of the Syrian Delfins during that period. The one I'm about to do had a serial 130 and it was special among others for having a red nose and rudder. Roundels on the fuselage are also visible without the green stars...

Here's the source:

http://luftwaffeas.blogspot.com/

cheers,

Vasko

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Hi,

sorry, me again, I hope I am able to help ;)

I am doing a Mig-17F of the Egyptian Airforce of the same time period at the moment, that is why I am interested in your decals and in the hawk in particular!

here is my assortment of decals:

IMG_6384_222_1_zps5b1ac3af.jpg

the HI decal one is very close to yours but the flag dimensions are different... the Iliad design ones wiht the red/ gold outline might do for a Syrian hawk as well!

your Eduard ones seem to be for the eagle of Saladin used in Egypt from up around 1979 till today but without the black outline! the shape of the "bird" is clearly different!

I am not sure if Syria used this anytime!

here is the only photo og a Syrian L-29 I could find:... no roundels though :(

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-53icueMhZFo/VFcb-YRR0kI/AAAAAAAADYg/JHGIDvfnr2M/s1600/SyAAF%2BL-29%2BKweres%2B(1).jpg

Edited by exdraken

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Nice work. There's some great looking detail in that kit. Is there any noticeable difference to the surface finish after the Tamiya wax has been used?

Cheers,

Mick

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Nice comparison Werner, please, no apologies, it's interesting stuff you posted. I'm pretty sure it's not just us that is intrigued by this...

I have a single photo showing the Delfin with one of the mentioned flags on the tail. The aircraft on the photo is in pretty bad condition, with markings badly weathered out, but the golden eagle can be recognized - which one, that is hard to say.

I'm sorry but I cannot post any photos as they are not mine and since there are people on them and other personal reasons, I have been instructed not to publish them...

R.S, the author of the mentioned blog can answer some of your q's. Feel free to ask him, he's a cool guy and he knows a lot about SyAAF...

To be honest I haven't thought a lot about those eagles/hawks until you mentioned it, I haven't realized there are so many variants, I only thought some are printed better than the rest... Thank you for bringing that out.

@Mick

There is some more shine after waxing. But to tell you the truth the visual effect is rather minimal. More of a habit... but still, the polished surface is easier to handle, no worries about fingerprints and rubbing off paint..

cheers

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Vesthepes,

EXEMPLARY start to your super project... :yahoo:

Looking forward to seeing more of this fantastic model....

HOUSTON :thumbsup:

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Greetings,

I would beg to differr about the eagle. Syrian aircraft never carried the eagle as far as I know. Fact is that the Egyptian airforce did deploy squadrons of Mig-17,Mig-21 and Su-7 regularly to Syria. actually a Mig-17 squadron did participate in the Yum kippur war on the Syrian front and lost one third of its strength during the first five days of the fighting.

Syrian aircraft either had black, white and green flags with two stars or red, white and black starts (two or three stars depending on the era (The stars signify the number of countries in the United Arab Republic at theat time (Syria, and Egypt).

The Syrians had only stars on thier fin flashes and the Egyptians had the stars up to 1972 I think.

You could contact the Group 73 Historians for more information on the Egyptian side but honestly, I have no confirmed information on Syrian aircraft wearing the eagle. Non that I have seen while travelling in Syria or in pictures of Syrian aircraft.

The Egyptians flew the L-29 in attacks on the Israelis in 1973 and there is a film on the Group 73 website showing Su-7s and L-29 in low level attacks on Israeli armour

Should you decide to put an eagle then I would suggest a good research because they were also painted in different ways and sometimes in a very crude way. The clean ones that we know were produced after the 1973 war.

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Greetings,

Here's a link with that L-29 that was on display at the Damascus Military Museum. I have taken a couple of proper pictures of that plane but can't find them anymore.

The badge on the side of the nose is a mainatanace unit badge and not a training unit.

https://milinme.wordpress.com/2012/08/13/damascus-military-museum-3-the-aircrafts/

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Thank you for your comments everyone, I really appreciate it...

greetings swimmer

Thank you for your input.

All I can tell regarding the eagle is my source and his references tell otherwise. It is a confirmed information about the eagle and the stars. As I previously mentioned there is a photo showing a SyAAF Delfin carrying a flag with the golden eagle. Also there are several photographs of Delfins while operational showing the red/white/black roundels with no stars. In many cases serials are visible. The only Syrian Delfins on these photos wearing stars are the ones in derelict condition attached on poles as gate guardians or museums.

As for the Egyptians I really wouldn't know as we only discussed Syrian aircraft. But I have used the same markings as if was in fact Egyptian.

I will ask him more about this as I am pretty sure he can explain it much more than I do.

best regards

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IMG_20150407_144657.jpg

When it comes to Syrian Arab Air Force and, say, 1973, the sheet to the right would be the only one correct here (and that is based on plenty of 1st-hand-sightings).

Greetings,

I would beg to differr about the eagle. Syrian aircraft never carried the eagle as far as I know. Fact is that the Egyptian airforce did deploy squadrons of Mig-17,Mig-21 and Su-7 regularly to Syria. actually a Mig-17 squadron did participate in the Yum kippur war on the Syrian front and lost one third of its strength during the first five days of the fighting.

It's correct that SyAAF aircraft never carried the Eagle of Sallahaddin. Only the Hawk of Quresh.

That said, the EAF deployed only its No. 62 Squadron to Syria, from 1972 until late 1973. This unit actually lost nearly two thirds of its aircraft and pilots - though during the entire October 1973 War (first part of their 'adventures' can be read in Arab MiGs, Volume 5; much, much more is to follow in Volume 6, due out in October this year).

More than ten years earlier - from 1958 until 1961 - two MiG-17F-squadrons of what was then the United Arab Air Force were based permanently in Syria. Also, UARAF Il-28Rs would regularly land there (for example after making recce flights over Israel). But, at that time Syria was 'Eastern Province' of the United Arab Republic, and there was no 'Syrian Air Force'.

Syrian aircraft either had black, white and green flags with two stars or red....
Yes but: this _earliest_ form of SyAAF markings was worn by only a small number of MiG-15s and MiG-17s acquired by Syria in period 1955-1958, and never again, nor ever on any of SyAAF Sukhois, Aeros, Ilyushins, Antonovs etc.)
You could contact the Group 73 Historians for more information on the Egyptian side...
...which would mean that the question would eventually land on my table, because they would in turn ask me (as they always do in such cases). ;-)
...but honestly, I have no confirmed information on Syrian aircraft wearing the eagle.
Not the 'Eagle', but the 'Hawk', and I've seen it on plenty of their aircraft with my own eyes.

Such Syrian markings were in use from 1972 until 1980, though many can still be found on museum pieces or various of aircraft abandoned/taken out of service in the early 1980s.

The Egyptians flew the L-29 in attacks on the Israelis in 1973 and there is a film on the Group 73 website showing Su-7s and L-29 in low level attacks on Israeli armour...
The EAF had two 'big squadrons' (sometimes called 'brigades') equipped with armed L-29s and these flew nearly 100 combat sorties during the last few days of the October 1973 War.

Syrians didn't rush their L-29s into 'direct' combat, but they did use them to fly maritime patrols off the ports of Latakia and Banias (in October 1973).

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Howdy,

Here's some more. Those pictures were made just before they closed the museum and they just went and painted everything with new colors and camo so, no more originals.

http://luftwaffeas.blogspot.de/2013/02/air-force-museum-dimashq-syria-updated.html

The only times any of aircraft in the former 'Military Museum of Damascus' (closed already in 2010 because the then Turkish PM Erdogan felt offended that 'such a museum' would be situated in the backyard of an ancient Ottoman Mosque) were showing their original colours was back in 1974. That is: immediately after they were put there.

Subsequently, they were re-painted every single year (I've been to that museum at least six times in the mid-2000s, and have photos of each aircraft, providing clear evidence for that). Colours used (orange-sand, blue-green, and light blue) were authentic, i.e. the same as those used by the SyAAF: but their camo patterns definitely not. Their serials even less so (most of them disappeared already by 1981 or so).

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here is the only photo og a Syrian L-29 I could find:... no roundels though :(

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-53icueMhZFo/VFcb-YRR0kI/AAAAAAAADYg/JHGIDvfnr2M/s1600/SyAAF%2BL-29%2BKweres%2B(1).jpg

Correct - and important - observation: no roundels on SyAAF L-29s.

That 'tradition' was introduced already with MiG-21F-13s purchased in 1963-1964 period. Only MiG-15s and MiG-17s - which were in service since earlier times - have retained their roundels: all other combat aircraft types introduced since re-build of the SyAAF in 1961-1962, wore no roundels at all (and this means not only MiG-21s, but MiG-23s, MiG-25s, MiG-29s, Su-7s, Su-20s etc., etc., etc.).

Which reminded me... of an artwork depicting one of authentic SyAAF L-29s (and then the example that used to be on display at the Military Museum in Damascus), as can be seen here (top of rear cover of Arab MiGs Volume 4).

Edited by Tom Cooper

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Thank you Tom for explaining about the eagle and hawk.

I'll try using the golden one, trim the edges, make it shorter...

Correct - and important - observation: no roundels on SyAAF L-29s.

I don't know.., I have at least two photos showing operational SyAAF delfins with roundels without stars on fuselage behind the wing root. Roundels on wings cannot be seen because of the photo orientation. There are other photos showing roundels on the bottom side of the wings - but not operational aircraft, the ones posted on poles...

Edited by vesthepes

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Photos of 'operational SyAAF L-29s with roundels on fuselage'...?

Alone photos of _operational_ SyAAF L-29 are as rare as snake's sweat, mate. Actually: I've only seen one so far, and there was no roundel on it. Are you sure the aircraft in question was genuinely Syrian? For example: how many stars can you count on that roundel?

Anyway, there were roundels - on top and bottom wing surfaces (i.e. 4 in total).

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As far as I know, yes they are SyAAF delfins.

There are roundels with no stars inside visible on the fuselages of operational delfins.

On the photos of non operational posted on poles there are roundels on edges of the wings visible with two green stars. But they are very weathered on an aircraft exposed to sun for a longer period obviously.

As I already mentioned the source is the author of Luftwaffe A.S blog. I believe it is reliable as any other photos of SyAAF coming from him. I see no reason why to doubt that...

cheers

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OK to continue with the kit.

A few stencils, black stripes and a serial 130 on the nose added.

IMG_20150413_131424.jpg

IMG_20150413_131016.jpg

I still have to tackle with the window separating the pilot's space from the trainee's. This is one of the most complicated things on the models - the window structure (the bow) is molded in one piece with the fuselage so it's kinda hard to fit in the window afterwards...

Oh yes among the less well engineered things (in a builders perspective) are also the pitot tubes molded together with the wings. No way they would survive in one piece all the procedure, I cut them off during assembly and will add them back on in the final stages.

cheers

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very nice progress!

that build will be a stunner!

thanks for sharing your building experience , will be helpful for mine for sure!

:) :)

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By the way: My sincere apologies for forgetting to congratulate you on this beautiful build :-)

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