Pocher Mercedes 540K True Roadster Build

[Codger]

X2!!! please............

[larchiefeng]

Ditto, it would be nice to see all the 1/8 and 1/12 scale cars in one place.

[larchiefeng]

First up tonight are some progress pictures of the 540K True Roadster

Got the engine mostly finished and ready to install in the frame for test fitting

Here we go finally putting the engine into the chassis

OK, that's all of he 540K for now. Now we move to the 500K Cabriolet engine resurrection. Here is today's progress; I finished getting the rest of the parts off and sanded and painted some of the bigger main parts.

A little clean up

Here are the main engine pieces with the first coat of paint

So here is the one piece that will be different from the other engine just for the sake of mixing it up

Over the next few days I will post more of the Roadster pictures since it is pretty much done as far as the chassis and engine goes and I will continue to post the progress on the 500K Cabriolet. At some point I should be able to put the two chassis's side by side just to prove there are actually two Mercedes being built side by side. That is actually what I'm looking forward to.

Quick note: in all the pictures of the engine I just posted you can see the engine I'm now working on. I will also post before and after pictures of it when its done.

[Codger]

Great to see a 'Pocher assemblyline'!

[larchiefeng]

Thanks Codger! I'm trying my best to add more Pocher's to the forum. It's about 8:30 am here and looks like a beautiful day shaping up so, I should be able to get the "assembly line" fired up and moving soon. I will post today's progress later tonight.

[foxfriend]

This is brilliant, keep up the good work. That engine looks terrific.

What with this one, and Roy and Codgers, I have finally come to the conclusion as to what I should do on future builds, (not Pocher I might add!). The thing to do is to not look in on here so often, and that way I won't get a headache trying to do modelling type things that I find impossible!!

Now, where did I put those anti-depressants...................

[larchiefeng]

The first set of pictures are again of the 540K True Roadster

Wheels and tires are finally on.

I like the way the gas tank came out

Overhead with wheels and tires on and the engine is just sitting in the frame for the picture

Here I just set the cowl and the body on the frame to see how things were lining up

More shots around the car to see how thing will look. The wheels are black because the body will be all black and the interior is red leather. The cable sticking out is a guitar string because this kit didn't come with a throttle cable or the supercharger linkage but all has been added.

This close up shows the guitar string throttle cable and along the engine block is the added supercharger linkage. Also you can see the 1.4mm brass nuts i added to each end of the copper line to approximate the nuts that would tighten down on a real fuel line

The carb and supercharger are painted in Alclad airframe aluminum which looks like chrome but, more realistic and is easily handled without dulling or the finish coming off.

The front of the engine shot shows at least 9 different colors; all are subtle but give the engine a bit more interest. The colors are as follows:

Valve cover and supercharger are Alclad airframe aluminum, water outlet is Alclad copper with hand painted brass nuts, cylinder head is Tamiya gun metal with hand painted steel bolt heads on the manifold, the intake manifold is Alclad chrome, the exhaust manifold is Model Master metalizer burnt metal, engine block is Tamiya gloss black, and the front timing cover is Alclad white metal.

I couldn't help myself here, I just painted the body flat blat to try and get a sense of what this is going to look like black and to get rid of that awful beige color.

OK, next is the little bit of progress I made on the Cabriolet tonight. I spent most of the day doing "honey do's" and painting a bathroom instead of the Mercedes engine parts. I did manage to clean up the seam and mold lines, prime and get the black undercoat on these parts so I can spray some Alclad tomorrow.

Parts to be cleaned

Parts primered

Tools of mass destruction

Parts with black base coat for Alclad

Here is the 500K with the different lower piece than the 540K

The timing covers with just primer because they won't need a black base coat for the Alclad white aluminum color

Here is how I save myself a lot of time when painting the Alclad. I use my old trusty Badger 200 single action siphon feed airbrush and a 28mm cap I picked up from Hobbylinc so I can switch colors easily by just unscrewing the cap from the paint and detaching it from the airbrush and letting any excess paint drain back into the bottle then a quick wipe of the siphon tube, attach it back to the airbrush and stick it into a bottle of thinner and spray thinner through the air brush for a minute or two and then screw the cap onto the next color and do it again. It really saves on wasting the Alclad.

OK that's it for now, hopefully I can get some more done tomorrow. Probably will paint some more engine pieces and paint the detail like bolt heads etc.

[roymattblack]

Brilliant work here.

It's great to see a Pocher factory from the inside!

My eyeballs keep drifting to my own Mercedes box now but I'm determined to resist it for a good while.

Out of interest, what colour will the other Merc be?

Roy.

[Codger]

Brilliant as Roy says; he ought to know!

Great color work on engines and you Alclad applications are perfect. Very informative and entertaining.

Stealing --errr, watching with interest!

[larchiefeng]

Thanks guys I really appreciate all your comments over the last few days. To answer you Roy; I haven't really given much thought to the color on the Cabriolet other than maybe I would see about polishing the black body as is. But, to be honest a lot will depend on how the roadster paint goes as far as spraying the larger body. I'm even toying with the idea of getting some automotive paint and spraying it with a larger spray gun I bought. The canister holds around 6-8 ounces of paint so there would be enough to shoot all the body in one batch. The proviso here is that it really needs to warm up here before I can attempt that.

Codger, I really like using the Alclad paints because they lay down so perfectly and the color is pretty amazing. The first time I used the airframe aluminum I was hooked on that color, it gives such an amazing look and I think it actually looks deeper than the chrome. I'm also going to use some new colors on the exhaust system like a red or a blue burnt exhaust somewhere off the manifold and pale burnt exhaust on the mufflers. How much and where is still TBD.

A couple more things with regard to interiors; I'm debating on whether or not to cut out the seat in the roadster or maybe just make a cut along the top of the seat back wide enough for the seat back leather to roll over the back and down and the same for the convertible top as well. I'm trying to eliminate the frayed edge between the two and I think even with some piping on the seat there would still be the top to deal with. I also hate the color of the Mercedes floor material and if memory serves me, Roy, didn't you source a blue carpet material for your Alfa? So, I need an alternative for the carpet color and something for the top tonneau cover that would look right with the black body and red interior. I picked up the leather from Marvin at MMC and it is soo much better than the kit material. The kit "leather" looks very toy like and really is a disappointing way to finish a car that you have spent countless hours building and detailing.

So, any suggestions are welcome on Cabriolet colors, carpet and top material sources, and feedback on my thoughts on cutting a slot for the material to go over. I've also been tossing around the idea of just cutting out the seat entirely and building one from scratch. I'm on the fence with that idea though. There are always decisions to make when building a Pocher and because of the parts count and level of detail you really need to be thinking way ahead on these kits. I'm sure Roy and Codger can attest to this as well. I spend almost as much time orore just doing research or thinking about what goes where and when. At every stage I'm in during the build I'm always building that part in my head and then when I have resolved what's what I write it down and in order of operation. As I'm writing things down other things pop into my head that need to be done and then I will write it all down again in order. Maybe I'm a little anal about this but, it keeps me from having to redo things over again and, in the case of the Cabriolet, it has made this one go 10 times as fast because I know what comes next and in what order. It's sort of like Paul Koo's DVD but more detailed from personal experience. OK, I've bored you all long enough so, it's time to go shoot some Alclad pieces and paint nuts and bolts. I'll post some pictures tonight.

[Codger]

It's sort of like Paul Koo's DVD but more detailed from personal experience. OK, I've bored you all long enough so, it's time to go shoot some Alclad pieces and paint nuts and bolts. I'll post some pictures tonight.

You're not boring those who crave these models but have never tackled one.

Your method is very much like mine and I'm glad you pointed it out to prospective Pocher builders. Except, I don't write things down; I just mentally 'build' a area, long before I get there or while I prep the parts. Then I evaluate if I can do what I want and possible alternatives if not acceptable. This is a valuable insight to those fearful of the Pocher experience and makes the tasks much more manageable. Great point you made. These models are about the planning and build philosophy as much as the doing.

A tip for carpet color; try this. I bought mine here and love it. It's the 'Cherry' color and made for 1/12 scale, it's perfect for our 1/8. High quality, cuts cleanly and great color selection. Generous amount too, 14" x 20":

http://www.miniatures.com/Carpeting-C216.aspx

[larchiefeng]

Thanks Codger it looks like the cherry might work with the MMC red leather. OK, I still have newer photos of the 540K Roadster so we'll start with those. Most of these were shot when I was fitting things and just getting different angles for myself and the paint work

I did a two tone paint on the cowl/firewall with gloss aluminum and gunmetal

Back apart for more fitting with the MMC steering linkage

A better picture of the rear end and gas tank

A better shot of the steering linkage

The rear end again

With the steering gear installed

Overhead shot with steering box and trans installed

Another angle

This shot shows off the different shades of color on the metallic parts

A quick mock up with the lovely brown fenders

Starting to add some detail to the firewall

The Cabriolet got some of the Alclad painted today and some of the bolt heads picked out with a brush, Here are some of the painted pieces in the background along with the none painted stuff in the foreground that still need the seam lines sanded smooth and primer and more Alclad colors. Of the 8 unfinished pieces in the foreground there will be at least 6 different colors used when painted. In the back you see all the carb and supercharger parts in the airframe aluminum and the tining cover in white metal and the black starter and dist drive unit.

This is an example of thinking through the process before assembling and where I made an error on the first engine. I decided about half way through the assembly that I was going to add detail by painting the bolt heads and it was a lot more difficult with things already attached in places that made it hard to get a brush on all the bolt heads. So, now we make the commitment to do it and it is more easily done. I need to go back and touch up with some black on the engine block but, hey its only paint and plastic so it is easily fixed.

Here is a shot of everything that will get some kind of painting; remember the engine that was sitting side by side with the roadster engine and look at what a difference a little paint makes. I'm not trying to do realism here like Codger does; I'm doing what I like and what looks good to me. I really like what Codger does but, I don't have the skills to do that at this point. A lot of that is technique, a good eye for the real life of a mechanical machine and lots of practice. The point here is; there is no right or wrong way to do these cars there are just different ways.

Tools of detail that are indispensable

As they say, more tomorrow.

And, Roy- what's next on the bench?

Wayne

[roymattblack]

That is looking seriously good Wayne...

In answer to your question - on my bench at present is the Big Heller Citroen - thread here:

http://www.britmodeller.com/forums/index.php?/topic/234977671-18-citroen-traction-avant/

After that one????

Maybe a scratch Aston DBR1...

Roy.

[larchiefeng]

Thanks Roy I will pop over and check out your Citroen after I post this.

These pictures of the 540K Roadster I'm posting might seem the same however most of the previous pictures were taken when I was fitting things and making sure everything was as I wanted. So, that's why they looked a bit disjointed like it was assembled and then the next picture it was back to the just the frame. You do tend to do a lot of that when building these kits, checking the fit and if you are satisfied with what will be the final result. Inevitably, there will be some part of the build that you just don't like or for whatever reason you are not satisfied with but, rather than obsess any more over it you just move on. I was reading Codger's latest post today about his dash on the Rolls and his misgivings about it. To everybody else it looks great but, when you pour over it day after day and know its just not quite what you want; in the end only you know it's not what you intended but everyone else loves it. Anyway, moving on here are some pictures of the roadster that are the assembled final version barring any catastrophic accidents.

The engine is finally mounted and the rest of the copper lines are in place

The engine in the background is the one I've been doing in the second half of these posts before I started it

There is still one canister to go on the driver's side and the horn had to come back off when the air cleaner went on

The second canister is finally in place

Going back to my earlier statements about not being happy with some things; I'm not happy with the bends and straightness of the copper lines. They just don't look crisp enough for me. For whatever reason I just couldn't get the rolled copper wire into perfectly straight pieces and the 90's weren't sharp enough.

The air cleaner is finally installed but, I still need to add two hose clamps onto the rubber pipe between the supercharger and the air cleaner. And after getting the air cleaner in place now the horn bell doesn't want to fit. So, some adjustment is needed.

Now we're getting into some sanding and fitting work on the body and I still have to make some decisions regarding keeping the seat in the car or cutting it out and going a different route

OK, we'll leave the roadster there for now while I ponder the seat issue. One more little thing that bothers me and it shows up in the pictures; that is the front wheels both are toed in. The reason for this is the brake lines are too stiff and want to push away from the frame into the backing plates and the steering side is looser so it moves the wheels. I think a bit of solder inside the rubber line should correct that issue.

Today's efforts on the Cabriolet's engine have mainly focused on the continued cleaning of seam lines and previously glued sections that needed cleaning up and painting. So the following are a few of the component parts after cleaning and painting and a view of all the parts before they combine tomorrow

I'm always amazed at how shiny the airframe aluminum comes out. it looks like silver jewelry.

Tomorrow I'm going to clean up some of my mistakes and maybe tone a couple of things down a bit. I think I will make my own wire loom holder for the spark plug wires and try and follow my own advice on how to install the plug wires this time.

[Codger]

Overall beautiful work Wayne. I understand your frustration with parts built and then found to be disappointing.

But don't despair, you've got two great replicas under weigh.

The Pocher lines bothered me too and not like 1:1 so I did many of them in various thicknesses of soldier or brass and ally tube. Cut away molded-on ones and made many new or added missing. My thread's too big to go back and look for it but I documented all of it.

Toe in and camber of wheels also a PIA on mine. Many hours trimming and fabbing new rods and links to get the right stance. Same with ride height; moved shackles and shimmed leaves to get what I wanted. You can shim or cut coils to avoid perched-in-the-air look.

Unless you got it figured, I made my own hose clamps that might help. If you can't find them, shout and I'll post 'em here.

Don't despair; they're both going to be stunning with what you're doing. This is great entertainment for big scalers...

Edited March 8, 2015 by Codger

[larchiefeng]

Thanks Codger! I think the wheels will straighten out with some solder inside the rubber line as it will be stiff enough to hold the wheels straight yet pliable to move back and forth. I have read your Rolls thread from start to the present location but good tips are always worth reading again. And, another good point for all builders of any models is to have a selection of styrene, brass, copper, aluminum rods and all sorts and sizes of wire and solder. These things and a pin vise and a selection of minature drill bit and superglue are a Modelers best friend and can fix, repair or scratch build just about anything. When I took this engine apart quite a few thing broke but were all repaired by drilling holes and inserting a rod and super gluing it back together. After a while using these items becomes as common as paint and glue.

[Pizzwizz24]

You're not boring those who crave these models but have never tackled one.

This is a valuable insight to those fearful of the Pocher experience and makes the tasks much more manageable. Great point you made. These models are about the planning and build philosophy as much as the doing.

Codger is exactly correct!

I'm sure there are many but I am certainly one that fits this description perfectly. With 2 pocher kits in my stash, for a couple of years now, I have yet to build up the confidence to tackle either of them. So often these types of builds seem to be accomplished by only the best of builders (which may be true) but to see and hear the process somewhat simplified is a pleasure. The detailed photos and descriptive trials are an invaluable source of education and encouragement on the process.

Looking forward to more of your updates.

Chris

Edited March 8, 2015 by Pizzwizz24

[roymattblack]

I too used umpteen different kinds of wire, rods, solder, etc etc, and also drilled and pinned many potentially weak joins etc on my Rolls Torpedo and Alfa Spider.

Again, searching here will find the threads.

The old Fiat rebuild had LOADS of pinning and gluing just to keep the old girl together!

It's all part of what makes building a Pocher such a challenge - and FUN.

It would be great if we could all put our Pochers together to make one big 'car park' for some pictures...

Loving what you are doing here.

Roy.

[larchiefeng]

I managed to get a little bit done today mainly doing a little scratch building on a spark plug wire loom. This took me 3 attempts to get it but, the funny part is that I went back to the first one I made. The first one had one of the end holes a little off line from the others so, I made another one and it was off on the hole spacing. The third attempt went perfectly, all the holes lined up, the mounting holes were perfect all was right with the world; if the engine had seven cylinders that is. Then I realized that I didn't want the wires coming out of the top of the loom; I wanted them coming up from the bottom and curling over the loom. So, since I hadn't finished the first one I just drilled 8 more holes in the bottom along with the 8 that were already there for the distributor wires. So, here is what I used: (1) piece 1/8" aluminum tubing 3" long. I used the spark plug wire from MMC for the wires and using that wire I drilled out the holes for the wires in the tubing using a #62 drill bit. I then decide to use some 1/16" aluminum tubing for the mounting pins into the block which I used a 1/16" drill bit and drilled 2 holes at a 90 degree angle from the wire holes. Now I'm going to follow my own advice and attach all the wires to the loom before I attach it to the engine block. I will cut off the rubber spark plug boots from the Pocher plug wires and drill out the end of the boots. I am going to attach the boots to the plugs in the cylinder head. Then when I assemble the head to the block all I need to do is bring each wire to the boot, cut to length and glue the wire into the boots. The same thing basically applies to the distributor wires as they will be also glued in the loom and they will just need to be brought to the distributor and cut to length and glued in place. Here are a few pictures of the looms. I still need to attach the wires for the distributor but, I want to get the water pump and distributor installed on the engine so I can approximate a length to glue on the loom.

Here was the start

Thinking that I have it where I want it

Mounted on the block

Here's about where I realized that this wasn't the way I wanted it mounted. I was wondering why I had all this extra plug wire left over

After a number of attempts and the one I am going to use is at the bottom and the famous 7 cylinder Mercedes ignition wire loom at the top.

Wires glued in for the plugs, still have 8 holes in the middle for the dist.

I don't know if I'll get much done tomorrow as this week is my week for doctor appointments. Had one Monday and one tomorrow so, Thursday on I can get back to the bench a little longer. I also received the rear end parts I've been waiting on for the 32 Ford Roadster build on the Pocher Alfa frame. I'm afraid I'm suffering from sensory overload at the moment. I watched the movie "Le Mans" last night with Steve McQueen and I pulled out my Porsche 917 of the shelf that I've started so, it's sitting there as well. The body already has the coat of Gulf blue on it and it needs some metallic's painted so, I think I'll throw those in the booth with the Pocher stuff; might as well make it a party!

[larchiefeng]

I just realized that you can see some of the 32 Ford roadster rear end parts in the picture right before the last one. They're sitting on top of the red container lid. They are 3D printed parts and will need a lot of cleaning up and a couple of coats of high build primer but, I'm getting a little ahead of myself here. We'll come back to this later.

[Mpfiend]

Hello,

Your work here is superb.

I have just taken delivery of the the K74 kit yesterday and your build photos will be an invaluable resource when I come to build mine in the next couple of months.

Thank you for taking the time to prepare these updates.

Best Regards

Keith.

[larchiefeng]

Thank you for your kind comments Keith. I will endeavor to try and impart as many tips and written explanations as I can that will supplement Paul Koo's indispensable DVD on the Mercedes. Keep in mind that this thread really should be two as I'm building two Pocher Mercedes here, one if which is your K74. I only hope I can get close to Roy and Codger in quality of build. Today is an off day for me but, tomorrow I will hit the workbench and see if I can get the engine mostly assembled and at least placed in the painted chassis. I hope to get some pictures of the two Mercedes side by side; well at least the engine and chassis's side by side.

[Mpfiend]

Thanks very much.

I'm looking forward to the next instalment

Best Regards

Keith.

[larchiefeng]

Today has started to be a fairly productive day and this is the morning's results. I am continuing to work on assembling the engine but, I'm currently waiting on some small touch up paint and glue to dry so, I'll post what I have so far.

I must also apologize for the picture size being a bit too large but I kept getting an error from Photobucket when I tried to re-size them smaller. Tonight's picture will be sorted out.

Here are most all of the painted engine pieces ready for assembly.

The next few shots are how to replace the kit plug wires with the MMC (model motor cars) wire and re-use the spark plug boots. The first thing is to get all the kit wires with the plug boots attached and then cut off all the spark plug boots.

Like this

This is what you will have left

Because the plug wire is a number 62 drill bit you will need to use that size in the end of the boot you just cut off but, start with something smaller so you can get the hole centered and then use the #62 bit. I started with a #69 bit as you can see the difference in size in the next few pictures.

Here you get a little better idea of the size difference between the two bits with the #62 in the pin vise and the #69 laying on the mat

Here is what the finished plug wire should look like however, I am going to attach just the boots to the plugs in the cylinder head first so, I can bring each wire to the plug and cut the wire exactly the length I want after the loom is installed on the side of the engine block. More on that when we get to the distributor and loom installation.

Here is the beginning of the engine assembly.

Since this engine had been assembled before and was taken apart there will some things that were glued on that look not perfect now. Like the cradle for the generator that looks all chewed up below.

Here we have the generator, water pump and timing cover installed but, as Paul Koo's DVD points out there is a gap between the timing cover and back plate. I'm going to cheat on this and superglue it together. I'm using this glue applicator in order to get in between the cover and the plate and then I'll just use a squeeze clamp to hold it until the glue sets up.

The clamp is a bit large so I had to pull off the front pulley and it works fine. Nothing like grabbing the old woodworking clamps for this

OK, more later and I should have the photo sizing worked out by then

[larchiefeng]

I guess I got a little ahead of myself, here is what the completed plug wire looks like