Admiral Puff Posted July 30, 2014 Share Posted July 30, 2014 (edited) I'm doing this aircraft as 462RAAF's 'W', as per Xtradecal sheet X72-146 and using one of the two Aeroclub nacelle/engine sets I picked up at Telford last year. Would it have been fitted with Gallay radiators, or Morris? They look like Morris in the instructions, but I'm not certain. Also, does anyone know of a faired nose for the B.II Specials? It wouldn't be a hard scratchbuild, but as an essentially lazy bugger I prefer to take the line of least resistance. Edited July 30, 2014 by Admiral Puff Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AWFK10 Posted July 30, 2014 Share Posted July 30, 2014 Aeroclub used to do a vacform Z-fairing - you could ask John Adams if it's still available. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tomprobert Posted July 30, 2014 Share Posted July 30, 2014 I'm doing this aircraft as 462RAAF's 'W', as per Xtradecal sheet X72-146 and using one of the two Aeroclub nacelle/engine sets I picked up at Telford last year. Would it have been fitted with Gallay radiators, or Morris? They look like Morris in the instructions, but I'm not certain. Also, does anyone know of a faired nose for the B.II Specials? It wouldn't be a hard scratchbuild, but as an essentially lazy bugger I prefer to take the line of least resistance. Admiral, I've done a fair bit of research into Halifaxes, and I think can answer your question. Judging by the date, I'd be 99.9% certain that at this time the aircraft you wish to model was fitted with the earlier Gallay rads. At this stage, it would still have been a 'standard Series I' and it wasn't until the IA came on stream (with the larger, completely glass nose and square fins) that the uprated engines were fitted and the Morris radiator (very similar to the Lancaster) was fitted. I've also got quite a few publications on the Halifax, and in one (Halifax - To Hell and Victory and Beyond) there is an actual picture and some information of the aircraft W7671/W that you mention. It is in its early guise with the mid-upper and front turret still fitted, and although not as clear as I would like, it appears that the radiator intakes have the pronounced 'chin' of the Gallay type, not the more vertical, slightly receding profile of the Morris radiator intake. It says that after battle damage, the aircraft was lost on Malta (crash landing) on 7th November 1943 - therefore it seems unlikely to have ever been fitted and upgraded with Morris radiators. It also states that the armament began to be phased out on aircraft in this theatre, so I imagine the mid-upper went first followed by the nose turret, and the fairing you mention fitted. I can't help with the fairing I'm afraid - but I would have thought if there's none available a Milliput master and a crash-mould wouldn't be too tricky? Hope that helps, Tom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graham Boak Posted July 30, 2014 Share Posted July 30, 2014 (edited) Certainly Gallay radiators on that early an aircraft. Don't confuse the square fins and the glass nose with the series 1a designation, although many do and indeed did at the time. The square fins were a rework for all Halifaxes, and the glass nose can be seen on reworked aircraft. The old Bombing Colours book (and series of articles that preceded it) had a whole page of drawings from Middleton St George/Croft showing the wide variety of possible combinations at the time these changeovers were happening. The designation belongs to the engine /radiator change to Merlin 22s and the Morris block radiators. Merrick, in his book mentioned above, does quote a few examples that blur this distinction, but basically if it has Merlin XXs it is a Series 1 and if it has Merlin 22s it is a series 1a. The engines were not generally (if ever) refitted to earlier aircraft, and certainly would not have been in the Middle East, nor so early. There was such a conversion available many years ago, though I don't think it was Aeroclub. Revell did show this nose on their preview sprue photographs, but it had disappeared from the kit when released - perhaps it will reappear on re-release. However, the early Middle East aircraft did not have the proper Z fairing but a locally-produced fabric covering, and this is almost certainly what would have been fitted to W7671 as to its sisters in photos across the page. You could manage this with just Milliput, no need for a mould first, as there would be no additional small transparent panels as in the Z nose proper. At least some of these aircraft only carried two guns in the tail turret, which is another mod you can include. Edited July 30, 2014 by Graham Boak 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tomprobert Posted July 30, 2014 Share Posted July 30, 2014 Thanks for the additional info Graham - I wish I'd come to you when doing research for my 1/32nd version straight away! Tom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brewerjerry Posted July 30, 2014 Share Posted July 30, 2014 (edited) Hi they turn up on e bay sometimes ( if it is what you are after ) http://www.oldmodelkits.com/index.php?detail=25422&page=881&soldarchive=1 I got one of these of e bay a few months ago cheers jerry ps might be worth asking here http://www.joesmodels.com/AEROCLUB_72_CANOPIES.htm Edited July 30, 2014 by brewerjerry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chaddy Posted July 30, 2014 Share Posted July 30, 2014 As I've said before, I'm surprised Revell didn't include the fairing in the original kit, seeing that so many aircraft had this feature, and they have the mould for it. And, given that Revell didn't include it, I'm even more surprised some that some after market manufacturers haven't come up with it either. The number of people (including myself) on here looking for one would have given some idea of how popular it would be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AWFK10 Posted July 30, 2014 Share Posted July 30, 2014 Certainly Gallay radiators on that early an aircraft. Don't confuse the square fins and the glass nose with the series 1a designation, although many do and indeed did at the time. The square fins were a rework for all Halifaxes, and the glass nose can be seen on reworked aircraft. The old Bombing Colours book (and series of articles that preceded it) had a whole page of drawings from Middleton St George/Croft showing the wide variety of possible combinations at the time these changeovers were happening. The designation belongs to the engine /radiator change to Merlin 22s and the Morris block radiators. Merrick, in his book mentioned above, does quote a few examples that blur this distinction, but basically if it has Merlin XXs it is a Series 1 and if it has Merlin 22s it is a series 1a. The engines were not generally (if ever) refitted to earlier aircraft, and certainly would not have been in the Middle East, nor so early. There was such a conversion available many years ago, though I don't think it was Aeroclub. Revell did show this nose on their preview sprue photographs, but it had disappeared from the kit when released - perhaps it will reappear on re-release. However, the early Middle East aircraft did not have the proper Z fairing but a locally-produced fabric covering, and this is almost certainly what would have been fitted to W7671 as to its sisters in photos across the page. You could manage this with just Milliput, no need for a mould first, as there would be no additional small transparent panels as in the Z nose proper. At least some of these aircraft only carried two guns in the tail turret, which is another mod you can include. There definitely was an Aeroclub Z-fairing, Graham: a clear plastic vacform. I used one on a Mk V I built a few years ago, along with a Dowty undercarriage from the same source. I'd had it knocking around for a very long time, having originally bought it with a view to modelling a different Halifax entirely from the one I eventually made, so it may have been out of production for quite a while. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graham Boak Posted July 30, 2014 Share Posted July 30, 2014 Thanks: I which I'd bought one then. I still have those Mk.V undercarriages around though I'll probably use the Revell ones on whichever kit I eventually use. I know exactly what you mean about kits changing subjects whilst being made/sitting on the shelf. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woody37 Posted July 30, 2014 Share Posted July 30, 2014 Unfortunately, the Aeroclub Z or Tollerton nose doesn't quite fit the new Revell kit as it was designed for the Matchbox one. Myself and John Aero discussed making a new one last year, I was going to form a part that he could mould it from, but still not got round to it My plan was to use the clear lower part and build up from that with a fairing made of car filler or something and John would make a mould from that. Hopefully someone beats me too it!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Admiral Puff Posted July 30, 2014 Author Share Posted July 30, 2014 Thanks, everyone - Gallays it will be. I'll also do her as depicted on the decal instructions, i.e. with the nose turret fitted, which will avoid having to scrounge a Z fairing from somewhere. I too have a recollection of seeing a Z on the initial sprue shots of the Revell kit - why on earth did they leave it out of the kit?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leyreynolds Posted July 31, 2014 Share Posted July 31, 2014 A man can't have too many Halifaxes! But WHEN will it be finished? Do you want to borrow Merrick's book at the next APMA? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Admiral Puff Posted July 31, 2014 Author Share Posted July 31, 2014 I CAN'T finish it - that would mean breaking a long tradition ... Thanks - the Merrick book would be useful. DC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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