Hugh Jampton Posted April 28, 2014 Share Posted April 28, 2014 This is somewhat of a special project for me, mainly as growing up in the 70's I have always been a James Hunt fan and for the fact that I actually bought this from a proper model shop in Leeds (there's hardly any London now) about a month ago. I knew the kit is dated but with a few hop ups can make a half decent kit and it will hopefully be my first completed 1/20 scale F1 car in 30 years. Along with purchasing the photo etched additions and the Marlboro decals I decided to buy the Haynes manual and a photo CD from eBay, it was when I started making my way through these that I noticed a few details I wanted to alter on the original model, the first one of these was riveting to certain panels, I had read about rivet decals on a slotcar forum a while ago and after a short search found that Historex supplied them in the UK. As I wanted to expand on the engine detailing (in awe of some of you guys on this forum) and while waiting for the rivet decals I thought I would complete the air box and use it a bit of a incentive to carry on. Made a start on the breaks so glued, filled and applied the photo etched disks then primed, now not sure whether I should have painted the PE parts or put them on after. Oh well, will have to see later. Rivet decals arrived and thought I would make a start on the rear wing which I had already primed so gave it a light gloss varnish hoping the decals would adhere better, this seemed to work so carried on with the spraying. I don't have an air brush and am a bit nervy of them from using the budget can feed ones I've tried before but seem to generally get a good finish using Halfords spray cans. The Mclaren red I know is a funny colour, some photos show a deep red while others show an almost day glow orange so after reading a kit review and the good comments of the newer Tamiya decal I decided to match the limited red/orange to these, apologies to Mclaren purists. The rivet do come out but only very lightly, which is what I should be looking for, I think. Could have sworn that I sanded the glue line to the front edge! The rivets were applied to the chassis using the reference photo's on the manual only to find it differed on other photos I have, can only presume the different chassis evolved during the lifetime of the car, anyway I'm happy with initial outcome. Regards John 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stu_davros Posted April 28, 2014 Share Posted April 28, 2014 Fantastic start John, those rivet decals really work well. If you need any detail pictures I have a boatload that I have taken of the cars at historic racing meetings. Cheers, Stuart Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sennapod Posted April 28, 2014 Share Posted April 28, 2014 Can I ask what size Historex rivets you've used I intend to do something similar for some other 1/20th F1 models - but am not sure on the sizing to use Thanks, Richard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hugh Jampton Posted April 29, 2014 Author Share Posted April 29, 2014 Stuart Thanks any reference photo's will be gratefully welcome, I'm new to BM and don't know procedures involved in passing info, unless of course you post to site, please let me know how best I can receive the pictures. Richard I believe I bought the starter pack (#AR88001 - Surface Details 1 Rivetheads / screw heads .008 .011 .014 inch in diameter) at £14.45 I was rather surprised how small the pack was, saying that though I think for piece of mind and to take a model that bit further they are worth it. Although they say you don't need to I would recommend giving them a coat of varnish after as it melts the excess film, especially around a curved surface but don't take my word for anything and give it a trial run, the sizing of individual rivets I left to my diminishing eyesight. I'm starting the engine block and looking to elaborate on the wiring and tubing, as mentioned previously I'm in awe of the detail some of you guys put into the engine and can only hope this one can be half as good. Regards John Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vicarage Vee Posted April 29, 2014 Share Posted April 29, 2014 Lovely work John, really looking the business. Yes, beware the rivet patterns. I don't know which car the photos you have are of but as I understand it one of the chassis was wrecked in 1976 (M23/8) and was replaced by M23/8-2 which was built new and took on the data plate. The wreck was subsequently rebuilt as a show car... who knows what rivets may have needed to go into that. Besides, the M23 was around for a long time and changes and rebuilds did take place. At the end of the day you'd probably need an ex-McLaren man or owner to spot the difference! The rivets were applied to the chassis using the reference photo's on the manual only to find it differed on other photos I have, can only presume the different chassis evolved during the lifetime of the car, anyway I'm happy with initial outcome. If you don't already have it, the histories of each race chassis are here: http://www.oldracingcars.com/f1/type.php?TypeID=M23 Lovely model, it's going to look splendid! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bear13583 Posted April 29, 2014 Share Posted April 29, 2014 Looking great so far, how are you going to tint the windscreen. It's the only thing stopping me starting it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hugh Jampton Posted April 30, 2014 Author Share Posted April 30, 2014 Mr Vee Thanks for link, great website. I used to read (generally look at pictures) of a F1 magazine around 82/84 and remember an advert for someone selling a M23, it did say it was driven by Hunt in 76 and if memory serves me right it was going for £25k, it's always stuck in my mind, if only, ok I was only on £5 pocket money a month and the shed would have had to be extended but............ Mr Bear First idea I had was to start smoking 60 Woodbines a day, it work for my grandad long ago, I remember everything being yellow. Honestly, I'm not sure, a wash or tint possibly, leaving it to the end and worry about that when I get to it, there's a small section I need to remove from the chassis for the front wheel track rod arm (I think, I know nothing about cars) and the arm itself as its not on the model along with a more realistic support bracket for the rear exhaust. Thanks for all comments, always welcome. Regards John Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roymattblack Posted April 30, 2014 Share Posted April 30, 2014 Looking really good so far. Love the rivets! Roy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bear13583 Posted May 1, 2014 Share Posted May 1, 2014 I was leaning towards some tamiya clear yellow in some future but wanted someone else to try it first! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hugh Jampton Posted July 10, 2014 Author Share Posted July 10, 2014 It's been a couple of months since my last post, I'd like to think that it's because works finally picking up after 5 years and I've been building a garden wall but the truth of the matter is I began work on the engine block and realised very quickly the anti-roll bar detail on the model seems to be an earlier arrangement. To be honest I don't know one end of a car from the other, so I may have got this wrong but as its been mentioned by Vicarage Vee each car was different, I would also like to Stuart for his vast collection of photo's that have helped me decide on the final design. I had little choice in deciding to make the anti roll bar with polystyrene rod of various sizes which have to pass through the photo etched rear wing mounting and have therefore manufactured in 2 parts. This has been rather fiddly and delicate and can understand why others with more experience would use metal rods and brazing. I was going to leave this post until the engine block was finished but have run into a problem that I was hoping one of you may be able to help me with. After reading an article on a Lotus 78 build I purchased some 0.4mm Ø clear brown tubing for fuel lines, to be honest I can't see the hole but have inserted some copper wire in it and tried to stretch the opening using a needle, all to no avail. If someone can let me know how to enlarge the ends, I would be grateful. Regards John 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SPARKER Posted July 10, 2014 Share Posted July 10, 2014 That is super cool, just finished the Senna MP4/4, will post a few pics in a few days. Keep up the good work Si Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shood23 Posted July 10, 2014 Share Posted July 10, 2014 Heat the tube up in a pot of hot water then try the needle again Hope this helps Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D1fuN0 Posted July 10, 2014 Share Posted July 10, 2014 Hi Hugh Car is looking excellent! I trick i picked up regarding the brown fuel line hose building my 1/12th F1 cars and bikes. Cut the fuel lines to the required lengths, then push one end onto a cocktail stick (toothpick), push it down as far as you can. Leave them overnight, then when you are ready, pull them off and insert them onto the pins as quick as you can. The hose stretches just enough to slide over the pins and returns to its original shape once its on. Hope it helps Steve 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hamden Posted July 10, 2014 Share Posted July 10, 2014 Very very nice this is progressing well looking forward to more of the same. Roger Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hugh Jampton Posted July 22, 2014 Author Share Posted July 22, 2014 (edited) Thanks for all the suggestions for fitting the fuel pipes, did I have some fun with those babies. In the end I dipped a small needle into some sunflower oil and rammed it up as far as I could then used a larger needle and oil to enlarge the tube even further, once removing the tube I quickly offered the enlarged (but rapidly shrinking) end of the tube to the injection nozzle and pulled it up using a pair of tweezers. The whole process took about 4 hours and a lot of hair pulling, when I do this again I will not be fixing the nozzles until the tube has been inserted, but saying that all the tribulations were immediately forgotten once completed and viewed. Almost finished the new anti-roll bar, the joints of the polystyrene rod proved very brittle so I glued some webbing to the underside of the joints, so there mainly hidden from view then once happy primed, painted black and finished with a light white dry brushing to enhance some features, it maybe not to ever bodies taste but it's something I picked up from figure and AFV painting in the past. The last piece of the roll bar is the end bits that connect to the rear wheel hub, I think I've got it right but will check my photos again before final fitting, but to be honest I wouldn't have a clue how it would work on the real thing. These 'end bits' are drying off before painting. In a fit of madness I bought some hose fittings and braided hose to embellish the engine further and will be onto this as soon as the suspension is complete. Regards John Edited July 22, 2014 by Hugh Jampton 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cosmosman Posted July 22, 2014 Share Posted July 22, 2014 Looking good Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
suggy69 Posted July 23, 2014 Share Posted July 23, 2014 Looking good, can't wait for the finished article! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hugh Jampton Posted August 28, 2014 Author Share Posted August 28, 2014 (edited) First of all, thanks for your responses. Anyway, just back off hols, I did want to send this post well before but as always kept putting it off. After my last post I decided I had gone as far as possible with the engine without it being attached to the main chassis and I had been putting that off for a number of months to be honest as I'm still not overly confident with spraying and masking. Going back to the engine quickly; I would like to ask the more experience of you a question, I purchased the Top Studio pack of photo etched hose connectors and jubilee clips, the jubilee clips were ok and fitted in well albeit seriously effecting my already declining eyesight but the hose connectors are causing me some headaches, do I superglue the initial strip & clip things? Any advise would be greatly appreciated. Prior to painting the main chassis I notched out a section of both for the track rod arm which is missing from the model, I was proposing making this in plastic rod but I don't think it would be strong enough so I may have to get the soldering iron out, which is certainly not one of my fortes. I scored a break line just behind the front suspension and also through the rear of the side pods as the later versions showed it removable then added more rivet decals along with 5# holes for larger rivet/fixings which will be added after final varnish. I also added a rivited plate on the covered area under the roll bar, again it appears to on later models, to be honest I rushed it a bit but am hoping it gets lost after the equipment is added. I'm going to leave this post now, I have gone further and will repost later in the week, telling you of a couple of 'balls ups' that could have been easily averted if I had only had some patients and indicating my lack of experience. Regards John Edited August 28, 2014 by Hugh Jampton 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hugh Jampton Posted August 29, 2014 Author Share Posted August 29, 2014 As mentioned previously, I've made a couple of mistakes on the M23 mainly through inexperience and my lack of patience. The first one was the cockpit cowling, I sprayed it up at the beginning using grey primer and was the only section that didn't have any white gloss finish as a result when I placed it on the main chassis, after masking I noticed it was a different colour, I knew my mistake straight away and knew it would have to be resprayed, this has been done at a cost of a new set of decals. The other that has left me floundering for the last couple of weeks, Once the top chassis was primed, sprayed gloss white, then I sprayed the thin red strip on the bottom of the side air intakes, it has run slightly but that can be touched up but after the hassle masking and spraying I decided to use the decals on the lower half and got a much better finish. Unfortunately the strip I sprayed is noticeably thicker and needs to come off. I'm still uncertain as to which way to go, complete striping off would be the best option, but I use acrylics and have tried oven cleaner and bleach with no effect, the one thing I know will work and have used previously on a resin body shell is cellulose thinners but it melted a test piece to a blob and it would also mean I would lose the rivet decals. I might try wiping the red stripe lightly with a cotton bud and thinners with a next to a running tap this weekend, sound desperate but don't really want to start over again, will let you know. Regards John Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hugh Jampton Posted June 28, 2015 Author Share Posted June 28, 2015 (edited) Been a bit of a while, through one thing and another I haven't touched the M23 for ages. I have been trolling the forum and been so impressed with so many of the posts, there's some great models being created. The main reason was I should have glued the top and bottom chassis before spraying and as soon as did I realised filling was going to be a pain in the bottom and shortly after cracks began to appear. As you can imagine I was slightly narked and ended up like always spending more time working out how to get round the problem than actually sorting it out. I wasn't overly sure whether I would carry on with this kit and buy another, I think I will continue with it although I'm still thinking of buying another as I've seen some american company selling the high air box used in the first 3 1976 races. Anyway, that's a pipe dream at the moment and I've started on an FW13b I started about 3-4 years ago and you never know I may actually finish a kit one day. Regards John Edited June 28, 2015 by Hugh Jampton Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hamden Posted June 28, 2015 Share Posted June 28, 2015 Looks OK to me - would be a shame not to finish it after all the work you have put into it! Roger Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vicarage Vee Posted June 29, 2015 Share Posted June 29, 2015 I agree with Roger, do finish it off, it was looking good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
injidup Posted June 30, 2015 Share Posted June 30, 2015 Love your forum name, Mr. Jampton. I know someone who's affectionately known as Hugh Jarse. Keep on with the McLaren, please! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hugh Jampton Posted June 30, 2015 Author Share Posted June 30, 2015 Gents Thanks for encouraging words, it's in my mind now to complete but still want to do another and possibly show them together, the other with the high air box. As for the name, it's an old Goons joke and a pure flight of fantasy on my part, unfortunately. Regards John Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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