Gisbod Posted January 5, 2014 Share Posted January 5, 2014 Hello All, I'm principally an aircraft modeller - haven't made a ship model since I was 8 (nearly 40 years ago!), but... I'm tempted to have a bash at one - I'd like to do 1/350, but probably best to start on a 1/700 to see how I get on? I really only enjoy high-end kits - I've got used to Wingnuts and the latest Tamiya offerings.. What are the latest equivalent in the ship world? I've had a look on the web and the Dragon Z31/39 seems to fit the bill? I think I'd rather limit it to British or German ships. What do you reckon? Guy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
prowler0000 Posted January 5, 2014 Share Posted January 5, 2014 Many reports i have read on the Dragon kits complain about the instructions being over-busy, & the kits themselves having very fiddly sub-assemblies. I own 5 Dragon ships & would tend to agree about the instructions: Utter NIGHTMARE!! Here's a link to the 1st step of the Z-31 by Dragon. scan thru em & see what you think..... http://www.1999.co.jp/eng/image/10153440z/70/1 Now, here's a page from Trumpeters Z-30: http://www.1999.co.jp/eng/image/10160642z/70/1 Similar ship (close sisters, in fact!), but a bit easier to make sense of. However, on the sub-assemblies, i have to disagree... Many modelers would be happy to lay out more money for similar details in resin that already exists in the kit! Horses for courses.(or burgers, depending... ) For a less stressful introduction to 1/350 ships, consider either a Tamiya Fletcher destroyer, Trumpeter "Z" class destroyer, or possibly an IJN destroyer. All destroyers, i know. But they're manageable sizewise, not as expensive as Capital Ships (so if you bugger it up, it's less pain on the wallet!) & theres a wide choice of em. Or, join the current trend here on BM & try a Submarine! Even cheaper, even easier, less paintwork AND lots of examples to study on here for tips... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gisbod Posted January 5, 2014 Author Share Posted January 5, 2014 (edited) Thanks, So you're saying the Dragon is more fiddly, but better quality? I like the idea of Tamiya because I know it will go together nicely, but all their new tooling kits seem to be limited to Japanese ships - which for some reason - don't interest me.. Is the Tamiya Fletcher a new tool? Guy Edited January 5, 2014 by Gisbod Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
prowler0000 Posted January 5, 2014 Share Posted January 5, 2014 Yeah, The detail on the Dragon kits is superior to the Trumpeter/Tamiya kits, but you pay a premium for that. Oddly tho, 2 of the Trumpeter destroyers in the "Z" class ships (30 & 43) have photo-etched railings, which neither Dragon nor Tamiya supply... Tamiyas Fletcher is mid/late 90's vintage, maybe a bit later, but you'd never know & its very affordable on certain auction sites whose name eludes me right now... I really fancy a Mogami Aircraft carrying cruiser, if only coz its so different! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gisbod Posted January 5, 2014 Author Share Posted January 5, 2014 Hmmm, Something to think about.. I've just seen a Dragon Smart kit 1/350 Z-38 on eBay for £26 free postage - it's double that at Hannants! But I'll probably do a bit more research.. Any other input? Guy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shar2 Posted January 5, 2014 Share Posted January 5, 2014 I wouldn't start with a Dragon kit, particularly their smart kits as the etch can be very fiddly. I'd probably go for a Trumpeter Z class destroyer or the Tamiya USS Fletcher. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gisbod Posted January 5, 2014 Author Share Posted January 5, 2014 Ps there's a new tool Tamiya Yamato from China which is about £170 inc postage - would you get hit by customs/import tax on arrival in the UK? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gisbod Posted January 5, 2014 Author Share Posted January 5, 2014 I wouldn't start with a Dragon kit, particularly their smart kits as the etch can be very fiddly. I'd probably go for a Trumpeter Z class destroyer or the Tamiya USS Fletcher. Thanks, I'll have a look at them all.. It's a shame you can't pop to your local model shop to look at the kits in the box like the old days! Guy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shar2 Posted January 5, 2014 Share Posted January 5, 2014 Shame you don't live a bit closer, as I could show you the rather large selection of kits I have which may help you out. Although if you're free on a weekend you're more than welcome to come up for lunch. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jockster Posted January 6, 2014 Share Posted January 6, 2014 Ps there's a new tool Tamiya Yamato from China which is about £170 inc postage - would you get hit by customs/import tax on arrival in the UK? It's likely that you would avoid import duty/vat/etc., but you cannot guarantee that you won't be the unlucky bugger to get nailed for everything. The new tool Yamato is NOT the kit to get started with though! Definitely get one of Trumpeters Zs, small, easy to build, good fit of parts, good enough photo etch and there are some aftermarket gun barrels and a wood deck for the bridge available! Happy hunting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Antoine Posted January 6, 2014 Share Posted January 6, 2014 If you really want to keep it simple for a first, try a submarine, there are plenty in 1/350. Cheap, simple build, ideal to try some specific technics related to maritime builds. Check hobbyboss range for exemple, or AFV, or revell. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seahawk Posted January 6, 2014 Share Posted January 6, 2014 Not all Tamiya 1/700 small stuff is Japanese or German. They also do a decent E-class destroyer and a V&W destroyer (marketed as HMAS Vampire). Vampire is I think their most recent 1/700 ship of any class: paint scheme pretty simple from what I recall. If you get into it, both kits could be a basis for a vast range of conversions reflecting the changes these ships and their many sisters went through over their lives. Both kits can occasionally be found on sale at less than completely eye-watering prices. I recently got the Vampire off the estimable Mr T7Models for £8.99. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gisbod Posted January 6, 2014 Author Share Posted January 6, 2014 (edited) Shame you don't live a bit closer, as I could show you the rather large selection of kits I have which may help you out. Although if you're free on a weekend you're more than welcome to come up for lunch.That's very kind.. You don't often get asked to lunch on the forum It's likely that you would avoid import duty/vat/etc., but you cannot guarantee that you won't be the unlucky bugger to get nailed for everything. The new tool Yamato is NOT the kit to get started with though! Definitely get one of Trumpeters Zs, small, easy to build, good fit of parts, good enough photo etch and there are some aftermarket gun barrels and a wood deck for the bridge available! Happy hunting. I don't think I was being too serious on the Yamato - I do tend to get carried away planning new projects! But I am always attracted to the best kits it's a weakness.. Having looked at the Tamiya Vampire (on the web) I've just realised how small the 1/700 ships are - I'm thinking the 1/350 will at least give you a chance of seeing the detailed parts.. I've also read the Academy Premium kits are good - getting everything you need in the box.. But again it means a big kit and a long project.. I guess a 1/350 Z Class is the sensible option.. If you really want to keep it simple for a first, try a submarine, there are plenty in 1/350. Cheap, simple build, ideal to try some specific technics related to maritime builds. Check hobbyboss range for exemple, or AFV, or revell. Yep, I know that makes sense, but I'm just more attracted to a ship... Guy Edited January 6, 2014 by Gisbod Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dfqweofekwpeweiop4 Posted January 6, 2014 Share Posted January 6, 2014 I built the 1/700 Z-31 by Dragon an it's an excellent kit, I had no bother with the instructions. The 1/350 German destroyers by Dragon look really nice too. BTW - there is no such thing as a German Z class destroyer (or Narvik class for that matter) - only the Royal Navy had Z class destroyers. The German destroyers were versions of 2 different designs - the 1934 type and 1936 type. I think the first 18, were 1934 and 1934A type and the others 1936, 1936A, 1936A Mob and 1936B type destroyers. The Z stands for Zestorer, which is German for Destroyer. If you want something quick and simple to build in 1/350, to get your eye in, try the Hobby Boss 1/350 sub kits. I built their Surcouf. It's a quick and easy kit to build, nicely detailed and comes with some etch. The only thing to be wary of, is that the colour scheme in the instructions is for WW2, so if you paint it like that, you'll need to leave off the catapult and aircraft as they were deleted by WW2. thanksMike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gisbod Posted January 8, 2014 Author Share Posted January 8, 2014 Thanks Mike, Yes, you may have gathered I don't know a huge amount about ships! (But I did recently read 'The Cruel Sea' - brilliant!). I'm definitely leaning towards a 1/350 Dragon 'Zestorer' Guy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dfqweofekwpeweiop4 Posted January 8, 2014 Share Posted January 8, 2014 Guy - I'm sure you won't be disappointed! I've had a look at one of the 1/350 Dragon German destroyers and they do look nice! I can't remember if the 1/350 ones have a full etch set or not, you may have to buy a set of railings or other bits to finish it off but you can get that from WEM easily enough. As for paints, if you prefer enamels, WEM paints will do you fine, if you prefer Acrylics, Lifecolor do WW2 Kriegsmarine paints (that's what I use). If you get their Kriegsmarine set 1, it'll have all the Grey's you need plus the red for the lower hull, if you model full hull, you'll only need a wooden deck colour for the small wooden deck area on the bridge. thanks MIke Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shar2 Posted January 8, 2014 Share Posted January 8, 2014 The Dragon German Destroyers, much like the rest of the Smart kit range only come with limited etch. You'll still need to source railings etc. Eduard do a range of diffierent types of ships railings, and Artwox do wooden decks areas of each of the different ships. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Antoine Posted January 8, 2014 Share Posted January 8, 2014 Yep, I know that makes sense, but I'm just more attracted to a ship... You can always build a surfaced sub! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alan P Posted January 11, 2014 Share Posted January 11, 2014 Are you set on a WW2 ship? If not I would also very much recommend the Trumpeter modern frigates and destroyers, like the Type 23's and especially their range of 1/350 DDG (Arleigh Burke) destroyers (not British or German I know but hey!) They do include PE railings although not the fine details you would find in a commercial aftermarket set. Also the modern naval range in 1/350 by Bronco are also very good, all available from UK stockists. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gisbod Posted January 12, 2014 Author Share Posted January 12, 2014 Thanks for that, but, yes, I'm fixed on WW1-WW2 (are you BA too Phatness?) I can get the Z-38 on eBay for £26 but, annoyingly, I can't seem to source any photo etch for that kit, Eduard or otherwise.. I can get lots of options for the Z-31 or 39 but the kits seem to be quite a bit more expensive? I don't want to get generic railings because the decks slope - so want ones specific to the kit.. Guy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gisbod Posted January 12, 2014 Author Share Posted January 12, 2014 Still looking on eBay - I fancy the Flyhawk detail sets they're pricey, but extensive! I can get the Z-39 one for £36 but the Dragon kit is around £40 or I have seen one for the Trumpeter Z-25? The Trumpy kit is £14!! But the the Flyhawk for that is £42.. Any views on Flyhawk or the Trumpy Z-25 in 1/350? Thanks again.. Guy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
prowler0000 Posted January 12, 2014 Share Posted January 12, 2014 I believe Eduard do a Railings set for the Z-25, & that's really all it needs.>maybe< some new gun barrels, but that's up to the builder, As are all decisions when splashing out on extras... The basic Eduard Z-25 set is mainly composed of replacement rafts, which, IMO, don't look as 3-D as the kit rafts (the supplied ones don't scrub up too badly in the 1st place!). http://www.britmodeller.com/forums/index.php?/topic/234932930-eduard-1350-german-z-25-destroyer-etch-sets/ I agree the FlyHawk set is pricey, & is a little superfluous to any modeler less than at master level, but i suppose it's got finer railings than most, Brass gun barrels, & a complete replacement for the deck, to achieve the subtle camber most destroyer-class vessels had. It your feeling lazy, ArtWorx do a small wooden deck for her, but get the Z-43 set instead, as you get 2 (TWO!!!) decks included, & the -43 set is easier to adapt as the bridge area is smaller on -43, so some quick work with a scalpel will reap dividends! Some bloke reviewed it here: http://www.britmodeller.com/forums/index.php?/topic/234924075-wooden-deck-for-trumpeter-z-43-zestorer-1350-review/ Although hard to find, The Dragon Z-39 actually HAS a complete guns/railings/rafts set by Orange hobby. It's a b17c# to find, but i got one, & it's really nice & good value, too! Only problem is, i only got 8 floats with my set, & thats clearly not sufficient for the ship.... As to Z-25 herself? Great model! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jockster Posted January 12, 2014 Share Posted January 12, 2014 You could consider Trumpeters 1/350 destroyer escort USS England with White Ensign Models photo etch. I started mine for the US Navy group build at the end of last year. Unfortunately the build has stalled after work and home commitments and now injury have kept me away from modelling at the moment. I look forward to getting back to it as it's a lovely little build! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alan P Posted January 12, 2014 Share Posted January 12, 2014 (are you BA too Phatness?) You're BA too? We'll be taking over this place soon! Al Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gisbod Posted January 15, 2014 Author Share Posted January 15, 2014 Thanks all for your help I bought the Dragon 1/350 Z-39 from my local model shop in the end for £40. The kit is fab! Really exceeded my expectations and I'll be doing a build log as I'll be hassling everyone for help along the way.. I've also ordered an Orange Hobby upgrade set from WEM - I went for that over the Eduard set as it has brass barrels too - hope that was the right choice? I didn't go for the Flyhawk as it seemed a little excessive for my first ship build. I need to finish up my Tamiya Mustang build first. I really ought to stop buying kits until I've finished the last - my focus tends to go to the new kit Thanks again Guy 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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