GLOSTER METEOR F.8 AND T.7 IN THE TT ROLE ...

[RAL]

A colleague and I are currently researching the use of the Gloster Meteor F.8 and T.7 in the TT role in the RAAF.

We know that the T.7 when used in the TT role had a lug installed to the rear of the auxiliary fuel tank which was used to hook up the cable and banner which was laid out of the runway. The aircraft was merely taxied forward until the cable was paid out and then took off on the sortie. It appears that the F.8 could be similarly configured for the TT role as there are references to such use by operational squadrons of the RAAF e.g.

75 Squadron (11 Aug 1955) - trials with a Mk.8 towing 'normal' banner.

77 Squadron (22 Aug 1955_ - using Meteor as TT for air-to-air firing practice.

75 Squadron (6/7 June 1956) an intriguing entry where it is noted that Meteor towed a 'radar reflecting' banner for tests with the CAC Sabre gun sight.

The standard procedure following the end of a TT sortie was to fly low, parallel to the runway and slip the cable and banner, then land the aircraft. This seems to have been applied to both the Meteor and the Vampire in RAAF service, although the latter used a simple bomb slip for towing purposes. I suspect that a similar towing technique was used by the CAC Sabre in the TT role although the tow hitch was merely a toggle held in place by the closed air brake. The cable was released by popping the air brakes. But I digress

Regarding the Meteor towing lug, I dont yet have definitive information on the positioning and attachment of this TT fitment. My early understanding was that the towing lug was fitted to the rear of the ventral fuel tank attachment point but this could compromise the use of the tank (?). For TT work, I would have thought that the additional fuel would be necessary and therefore Im now of the opinion that the TT attachment was on a hard point aft of the tank so that the ventral tank could remain installed and the towing lug was a separate fitment.

Errol OHaras story of his ride in a Meteor T.7 on a TT sortie has provided me with the only clue to date:

http://web.archive.org/web/20080801015408/http://www.gunnies.asn.au/squadrons/77/77sqn_images/errols_day/errol_o.htm

CPL Keith Dad Roddom, and his offsider, disappeared under the Meteor to hook up the target cable to a release unit at the rear of the centreline (Ventral) fuel tank.

This suggests that the towing attachment point could be at the rear drop tank mount as that area was already strengthened and mounted to the rear main plane spar. You don't get much stronger 'strong points' than that. In fact, it seems that it was highly possible to carry the ventral tank and a banner. Looking at the ventral tank of the Meteor, if you left the rear fairing off the ventral tank as was often the case, it may have been possible to attach the tow point to the substructure at the rear of the tank. Then, in an emergency you would have been able to jettison the tow (the lug was operated electrically by the aircrafts camera button on the control column) and drop the tank by pulling the handle inside the cockpit.

My colleague, an engineer by trade, baulks at the idea of having to go through the design and certification process to install another strong point just to tow a target when one was already on the airframe where you needed it. Therefore, our conjecture at this stage is that the UK boffins came up with the towing lug for the F.8 (and T.7) for use in the RAF and that we Aussies merely adopted it for RAAF use for both the F.8 and T.7

Any and all assistance would be appreciated.

Roger in Oz

[Mick Drover]

Fancy seeing you around here Roger!

I don't have any info on the subject but perhaps lads over at AMI can help...or not?

Cheers

Mick

[RAL]

Hi Mick

I'm more of a lurker than an active poster. I did think of AMI but as the towing lug was a UK innovation, I thought that our UK colleagues would probably have more definitive information.

And to all, apologies for the use of capital letters in the heading of my post - I forgot to change the draft before I posted.

Cheers

Roger in Oz

[McYellowbelly]

VZ467 was an F(TT)8, now at Temora Aviation Museum as VH-MBX

This photo I believe shows the towing point attachment at the rear of the Ventral tank.

Often described as a towing 'lug'

Think I may have seen drawings somewhere too

If I find them, i'll post them

[venomvixen]

[Daniel Cox]

Hi Roger,

The following archival resources might help in your quest, I haven't seen them myself but they might be of some use, Ive included Meteor Target Aircraft files as well because that might have further information that might be relevant;

National Archives of Australia

A703, 565/1/14, Flight manual meteor U MK 21.

A705, 9/95/8, Meteor aircraft - general defect.

A705, 9/95/221 PART 1, Meteor A/C Modifications.

A705, 9/95/302, DTS [Directorate of Technical Services] - Target towing - Meteor aircraft.

A705, 9/95/408, Meteor U MK 15 Aircraft - General technical.

A705, 9/95/410, Meteor U MK 15 Aircraft - Modifications.

A705, 9/95/473 PART 1, Meteor U, Mark 21 - introduction into RAAF.

A705, 9/95/479, Meteor Aircraft - Target Role.

A5954, 1394/2, Long range weapons establishment - Developmental trials of Meteor and Lincoln Target Aircraft.

A11404, 89/26/AIR PART 1, [No 1 Air Trials Unit] - Research and Development by Specialist Units - Trials Reports - Meteor Target Aircraft.

A11404, 2523/50/TECH PART 1, [No 1 Air Trials Unit] - Target Aircraft - Meteor Target Aircraft - General Technical.

A11404, 2523/50/TECH PART 2, [No 1 Air Trials Unit] - Target Aircraft - Meteor Target Aircraft - General Technical.

A11404, 2523/51/TECH PART 1, [No 1 Air Trials Unit] - Target Aircraft - Meteor Target Aircraft - LTC [Local Technical Committee], LMC [Local Modification Committee] and Local Servicing Committee Meetings.

A11404, 2523/52/TECH PART 1, [No 1 Air Trials Unit] - Air Trials Unit - Target Aircraft - Meteor Target Aircraft - Defects.

A11404, 2523/54/TECH PART 1, [No 1 Air Trials Unit] - Air Trials Unit - Target Aircraft - Meteor Target Aircraft - Defects.

A11404, 2523/55/TECH PART 1, [No 1 Air Trials Unit] - Air Trials Unit - Target Aircraft - Meteor U Mark 15 Aircraft - Telemetry installation.

A11404, 2523/56/TECH PART 1, [No 1 Air Trials Unit] - Air Trials Unit - Target Aircraft - Meteor U Mark 15 Aircraft - Handling and performance data.

A11404, 2523/60/TECH PART 1, [No 1 Air Trials Unit] - Air Trials Unit - Target Aircraft - Meteor Target Aircraft - Radar equipment.

D174, D5460/3/1 PART 1, Target Aircraft, Meteor UMK 15, Programme and Policy.

D174, D5460/3/1 PART 2, Target Aircraft, Meteor UMK 15, Programme Policy and Estimates.

D174, D5460/3/1 PART 3, Target Aircraft, Meteor UMK 15, Programme and Policy.

D174, D5460/3/1 PART 4, Target Aircraft, Meteor UMK 15, Programme and Policy.

D174, SA5225/4, Meteor Target Aircraft.

D879, DH95, [? Target Aircraft] maintenance commitment - Jindivik - Meteor - Lincoln [appendix C] CATEGORY: photograph FORMAT: b&w negative TYPE: glass plate STATUS: preservation material.

D879, DH96, [? Target Aircraft] maintenance commitment - Jindivik - Meteor - Lincoln [appendix C] CATEGORY: photograph FORMAT: b&w negative TYPE: glass plate STATUS: preservation material.

D880, D58/665, G A drawing - leading particulars of meteor Target Aircraft [figure 1A] CATEGORY: photograph FORMAT: b&w print TYPE: silver gelatin STATUS: preservation material.

D4994, 259, Target Meteor Aircraft - Working On Aircraft CATEGORY: moving image FORMAT: motion picture film QUANTITY: 1 of 1 reels TYPE: b&w 16mm negative, sound STATUS: preservation material.

D4994, 260, Target Aircraft - Meteor Preparation CATEGORY: moving image FORMAT: optical sound film QUANTITY: 1 of 1 reels TYPE: 16mm optical sound, mute STATUS: preservation material.

MP1926/1, 6012/3/28, Meteor and Lincoln Target Aircraft Development.

MP1926/1, 6012/3/98, Meteor Target Aircraft - Modifications.

Cheers,

Daniel.

[Dave Fleming]

Been discussed on here before IIRC, complete with illustrations (Dannii may have posted such, but as I'm at work, images are blocked!!)

[RAL]

McY, Danni, Daniel and Dave

Many thanks for your individual responses; they are appreciated.

McY - I believe that you are spot on with the towing attachment at the rear of the ventral tank on VZ476 (VH-MBX). Thank you for posting the image.

Danni - I must be getting old. Why I didn't think of you in first palce is beyond me? Many thanks for posting the diagram(s).

Daniel - what can I say. That is the most comprehensive list of references I've ever seen posted on a modelling site. All saved for further research, noting it will take me some time to work my way through them. Good stuff!

Dave - I hadn't realised that this topic had been discussed before. Thanks for the heads up.

Regards

Roger in Oz