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Revell 1/72 JU88A4 to A1?

PaulR

By PaulR
in Aircraft WWII

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Chuck1945 Very Obsessed Member

Chuck1945

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Yes the parts breakdown makes the A-1 (and A-5) version possible. Wether Revell will ever actually do it remains to be seen. Hasegawa's 1/72 Ju 88A-4 also has a parts breakdown permitting an A-1 with only adding A-1 specific engines, wing tips, fin/rudder and canopy (just as does Revell) but even approx 6 years after the initial A-4 version, no A-1 has been forthcoming.

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KRK4m Very Obsessed Member

KRK4m

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If I remember well the shorter wingtips should also fit the Ju 88C-2.

Maybe this option looks more attractive to the manufacturers?

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Byron Boyd Established Member

Byron Boyd

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It would be fairly straightforward to convert the Zvezda A-5 into an A-1, or just use the appropriate parts on a Revell A-4..

Yes, that's the way I would go too, at this stage. But Revell AG sure is missing a trick if they don't release an -A1 in 1/72, especially with a major BoB anniversary on the not-so-distant horizon.... Surely they can't be that dense.

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Byron Boyd Established Member

Byron Boyd

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Why do you ca't wait?

I'm not sure, but I'm convinced, that these two Ju-88 in 1:72 are not the only once from this kit. Study the sprues, you can see a lot.

modelldoc

Sorry, I'm not sure what you are trying to tell me.

I agree with you - both the Hasegawa Ju88A-4 and the Revell AG JU88A-4 are designed to allow multiple future variants. Indeed, the Hasegawa Ju88A-4 has already spawned (in no particular order) a Ju88C-6, Ju88G-1, ju88G-6, Ju88G-14 (multiple releases with various radar configurations), Ju88D-3, Ju188A/E, Ju88S, Ju88A-15(Trop), and Ju88A-4 w/balloon cutter.

Moreover, the Revell Ju88A-4 has now given birth to a Ju88C-6, and more variants could obviously be released. However, Revell AG does not have the same history for releasing a wide number of variations of an aircraft that Hasegawa enjoys, and here is where the frustration lies. Revell AG released a Ju88A-1 in 1/32 a couple of years ago, and now this year has released a Ju88A-4 in the same scale. One would think that they would do the opposite in 1/72, but they have not yet done so, and I have yet to see them release more than one variation of any particular aircraft. If Revell AG keeps to this historical pattern, then we will never see an A-1 configuration from them, which is a great shame.

So that leaves us with either modifying the Zvezda Ju88A-5 to an A-1 configuration, or using the A-5 parts from the Zvezda kit on the Has or Rev kits.

If you're really asking why we can't wait until a major manufacturer provides us with an A-1 variant, then the answer would be twofold:

1) There is a major Battle of Britain (BoB) celebration just about every 5 years now, and we are only about 2 years out from the 75th anniversary. The A-1 was the major Ju88 variant that participated in the BoB, with the A-5 just starting to arrive at the tail-end of the fracas. The A-4 variant did not begin arriving at Jagdwaffe units until after the Battle of Britain, so if one is going to do an accurate BoB Ju88, then one is somewhat limited in one's choices....

2) It's only been some 58 - 60 years now, with only a single Ju-88A-1 ever kitted, and that in 1/32 about 2 1/2 years ago. How much longer should we have to wait? Again, the A-1 and A-5 variants were significant; yet in all this time, we have only the Revell AG A-1 in 1/32, the Zvezda A-5 in 1/72 (about 1 1/2 years old now), the Lindberg 'I'm-not-sure-what-it-is' in something like 1/64, and the ancient Airfix Ju88, which is essentially an A-5 with the A-4 rudder and gondola. Although we all feel like we are immortal, the truth is that at this rate, some of us will never live to see one if we don't convert our own!

Did that answer your questions? Or am I just totally confused? :)

Have a nice day!

Byron

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Duncan B Blabber Mouth

Duncan B

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Forgive my ignorance, what are the major differences between A1, A5 and A4? I can see the wing tips are different, the engine nacelles too, is there anything else? Is it a big conversion job?

Duncan B (who is just starting the Revell Ju-88A-4)

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popeye Established Member

popeye

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Duncan,

A-1 and A-5 (early) had:

early Jumo 211 without intercooler in the lower engine nacelle,

corresponding different radiator & intake design in the front face,

early short wings,

rudder without aerodynamic balance horn (i.e. straight rudder hinge line)

no dorsal PeilGerät

variations of early canopies with no bulges (as on A-4)

lower nacelle (Bodenwanne) without armour

later in service however long wings (as for A-4) and sometimes even A-4 canopies were fitted to examples returned for repair and refurbishment.

If interested in the mods of a Hasegawa A-4 to A-1 see:

http://z15.invisionfree.com/72nd_Aircraft/index.php?showtopic=2203&hl=

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Clinton78 New Member

Clinton78

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The A-1 had a small life raft compartment. The A-5 onwards had a larger compartment to compensate for extra survival equipment carried. The A-1 and A-5 had a small hole just behind the power egg / just in front of the outer wing root where the nacelle joined. The A-4 had a small exhaust stub in this location. The dive breaks on the A-4 onwards were of a slightly different flatter variety to the chunkier/tubular type found on the A-1/A-5. The A-5 onwards had extra aerial cables running from the mast down to the sides of the cockpit canopy. The A-1s fuel jettison shute consisted of a single large opening whereas from the A-5 onwards this had two small stubs/shutes protruding from the back. From the A-5 (possibly A-4) onwards three handholds were positioned along the length of he fuselage these were not installed on the A-1 (possibly A-5).

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popeye Established Member

popeye

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thks for filling in more details, Clinton !

BTW the Squandron Signal brochures on the Ju 88 are quite helpful - incorporating a lot of drawings showing those details.

Rolf

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Clinton78 New Member

Clinton78

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Rolf, your welcome.

vppelt68. The A-1 generally had the single rotating Linsenlafette Z10d, made by Ikaria MG15 mount in the B-stand position. Early A-5 (Upgraded A-1) had a double MG15 mount but this early variety did not have the bulges or the rotating Linsenlafette Z10d mounts. The A-4 had the double bulged style rear canopy with two MG15s each mounted in one of two Linsenlafette Z10d mounts.

Quick mention of armour and armament. The A-1 had very little armour plating with the pilots seat being of the non armoured variety. Because of experiences in battle it was determined that the Ju88 needed more armour plating to protect the crew. This comprised of an angular armoured pilots seat and additional thick armour plates being bolted to below some of the panes of glass in the cockpit especially the extreme rear of the B stand position on the early A-5 (Upgraded A-1). Later versions of the A-4 and onwards had a rounded curved style of armoured pilots seat that completely encapsulated the rear and sides of the pilot's body and head. This style continued in use on later Ju88 and Ju188 variants. Armour plates were also bolted below the panes in the A-4s double bulged canopy window panes.

As with the armour battle experience meant that the Ju88 needed more defensive armament. This would comprise of extra sidewards firing MG15s being installed in either side of the rear canopy and or mounted in the front of the glazed nose. The armament increased on the late A-4 onwards with the installation of better more powerful MGs. As Rolf says these details are covered in a basic fashion in the Squadron Signal Ju88 brochure which can be picked up on the internet extremely cheaply. (hint, hint, nudge, nudge ;) )

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vppelt68 Completely Obsessed Member

vppelt68

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Thanks, Clinton! Any idea whether that single Linsenlafette stayed longer in use with the C- variants or did they convert to dual mounts on roughly same build dates than A- and D- variants? I know I should buy a book on subject Ju-88 but... but... all Finnish A-4:s had dual Linsenlafettes and bulged canopies so I´ll save my cents for something else :-) V-P

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Clinton78 New Member

Clinton78

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Not too sure as I've not looked into the C series much but from what I can see the canopies evolved as the C-series evolved just like the A-series:

  • C-1 - A-1
  • C-2 - A-5
  • C-3 - A-5
  • C-4 - A-5
  • C-5 - A-5 (two seater)
  • C-6 - A-4

To be honest the whole C-series looks like a mixed bag of various styles of canopy configurations. Some still carrying a single Linsenlafette mount but with various armour styles.

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Chuck1945 Very Obsessed Member

Chuck1945

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C models built as heavy fighters had the dual gun (bulged) rear canopy, night fighter Cs generally had only the single. Since some Cs were built/converted from A-5 airframes and latter ones from A-4s, it is possible that some early C version day fighters had the single gun mount.

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KRK4m Very Obsessed Member

KRK4m

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  • C-1 - A-1
  • C-2 - A-5
  • C-3 - A-5
  • C-4 - A-5
  • C-5 - A-5 (two seater)
  • C-6 - A-4

Years ago I was told that C-2 was also the short-span variant based on A-1 with C-3 being first to utilize the (then) standard 20-metre wing of A-5. Is there any new data published on the very subject?

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Clinton78 New Member

Clinton78

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I just copied what was in the first book at hand which was 'Junkers Ju88' By Manfred Griel (1990), but lets look at some other sources:

  • Junkers Ju88, By Ron Mackay (Crowood) (2001): Ju88C-2 Destroyer/Nightfighter - Developed from the A-1 but with increased wing span. Air brakes/wing racks deleted.
  • Junkers Ju88 & it's variants in WW2, Helmut Erfurth (Schiffer) (2002): Ju88C-2 Heavy fighter and Nightfighter - Based on A-1 but with increased wingspan.
  • Junkers Ju88 Volume 1, By Art Metcalf (Classic) (2013): C-2 Z/N Wingspan: 20.8m (as opposed to the 18.25m wingspan of the A-1)
Edited by Clinton78
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popeye Established Member

popeye

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If memory serves - LM/Kora did a resin conversion long ago in 1/72.

Anyhow - nowadays the easiest way might be modifying a Zvezda A-5 by cropping the wings and fitting a single rear gun (Ikara) canopy from Hasegawa or Falcon, or fitting a twin rear gun canopy with simple ball mountings - also from Falcon.

But I honestly think a short wing 88 to be around the corner sometime in the near future even if it takes more than a year...

Rolf

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Duncan B Blabber Mouth

Duncan B

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I'm building the Revell kit at the moment, some parts of the instructions aren't too clear. The exhaust stub numbering appears to be back to front for instance. Can someone explain what the two clear "portholes" are on the top off the rear fuselage aft of the DF aerial please (should they stay clear on the finished model)?

Duncan B

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popeye Established Member

popeye

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.

without pics I suppose you are talking of the 2 dorsal "lead-troughs" for the antenna connections -

these were Plexiglass and (more or less) translucent.

Rolf

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Clinton78 New Member

Clinton78

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The small circular plexiglass discs are where the aerial line/cable enters the fuselage. You have the main aerial cable running horizontally from the top of the cockpit mast to a point near the top and front of the horizontal stabiliser. From another point just below where the other cable attaches on the horizontal stabiliser another smaller length of cable runs down to the clear disc closest to the tail. Then from the long horizontal cable approximately above the other plexiglass disc a cable down from the main horizontal cable to the disc.

Rather like the plexiglass disc underneath that the FuG 10 antenna mast protrudes from. :)

These discs were originally clear but more often than not were painted over, especially the lower FuG 10 one.

Edited by Clinton78
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