turnerdad Posted October 16, 2008 Share Posted October 16, 2008 (edited) Hello all, After my crappy week last week, I decided to have a fun build, just me in m'shed sort of thing. Unfortuanately I can't take any time off work as such as I'm freelance and we need the money, but i've cut back the work a bit so I can have a little "me" time (thanks for the kind advice guys on my horrible week thread). Anyway I was intending to build this as part of the D-day group build but this kit winked at me in Hannants a few months ago, and has been sending out subliminal messages ever since. It's the "old" but rather nice AMT kit, but with some nice nose art. Gun nosed medium heavies-fxxk yeah!!! I'm building it OOB, only seat belts and some aerials, and concentrating on the painting and finishing, though I'm going to try and keep things quick and simple. I've finished the pit and the gun turret. The parts are nicely detailed, but Eduard do a set if need be. After a quick test fit and a light scotching, 2 light coats of Halfords primer and another light scotching to remove any dust I sprayed everything with Xtracrylics US Interior green. Then handpainted all the other bits, mostly with Citadel paints as they brush paint beautifully. I've dressed the parts up with some painted stencils, rivets etc just to busy it up without "adding" anything. Then 2 coats of Xtracrylics matt varnish, raw umber then black oil wash, foloowed by last matt coat. Battery about to run out....right, plugged in (almost lost this). The Eduard belts aren't quite long enough, which might be my fault, but I've matched some paint and continued them down which looks OK. A bar would hide it but this is supposed to be OOB! Also, the fit of parts is pretty good but there isn't much in the way of positive location, so take it easy if you are building one. Anyway, I'm really enjoying this, I've really missed this traditional building, with no scratchbuilding in site. My plan is to get this done and then back on with The Red Baron, from which I need a break! Hoping to have this done within the month, heavily weathered war weary Nazi hunter. Edited January 18, 2009 by turnerdad 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnonymousDFB1 Posted October 16, 2008 Share Posted October 16, 2008 Oh nice, I've been eyeing up this one for the D-Day GB. Will be interested to watch this one Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erwin Posted October 17, 2008 Share Posted October 17, 2008 (edited) Nice progress. Edited October 17, 2008 by Erwin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muller Posted October 17, 2008 Share Posted October 17, 2008 Lovely work so far, love the shading/weathering. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stebos Posted October 17, 2008 Share Posted October 17, 2008 Some very subtle washes there, is that the advantage of oil paints? My acrylic washes never get close to that smoothness. How much do you thin them? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turnerdad Posted October 17, 2008 Author Share Posted October 17, 2008 Some very subtle washes there, is that the advantage of oil paints? My acrylic washes never get close to that smoothness.How much do you thin them? Throw away your acrylic washes right now, go to an art shop and buy a set of oil paints (don't need to spend much-about £10 will buy a Daler and Rowney set with 10 or so colours). also buy a sepearate tube of raw umber-I use this colour alot, it just looks right. Thin with white spirit as it evaporates fast, turps takes forever. From my observations, do your washes over a couple of coats of acrylic matt varnish-touch your thinned oil laden brush on it and it tends to spread out nicely. It won't lift the paint (I've found xtracolour can though-me no likey)-I spray with acrylics, Tamiya, Gunze and xtracrylics and they are all great paints and I've never had a problem with the paint lifting. Klear also protects paint nicely, but being gloss, and therefore smooth, the oils tend to "run about" and I've found it harder to get subtle tones-works well on large assemblies, panel lines etc. The rougher nature of the matt varnish allows the oils to fill all those microscopic canyons etc, which with heavy weathering is perfect. You need to thin the oils but how much is up to you. Experiment. The pigments are very powerful, so it can be extremely thin. You can build it up in layers, or just do one coat, whatever takes your fancy. And as oils take so long to cure, you can manipulate it on the model, long after the white spirit has evaporated. Generally I'll put a thin coat of raw umber on, maybe 2, enough to stain the paint, then leave in the airing cupboard overnight, then put thin black wash over that in the morning. Play around and don't be afraid of it-it's fantastic stuff. And yes, another advantage with oils is you can blend them together even on the model to get an infinite variety of tones and colours. Normally I'd have airbrushed on some other tones, so the effect would be even more pronounced, but this is a quickie, plus it doesn't really need it IMHO. I still have to work on my pics, some arn't very sharp-will try a blue background. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T-Tango Posted October 17, 2008 Share Posted October 17, 2008 Starting to look really good already, lovely paint and weathering. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rowan Broadbent Posted October 17, 2008 Share Posted October 17, 2008 Great technique and advice, Turnerdad - not to mention a beautiful model in the making! Throw away your acrylic washes right now, go to an art shop and buy a set of oil paints (don't need to spend much-about £10 will buy a Daler and Rowney set with 10 or so colours). also buy a sepearate tube of raw umber-I use this colour alot, it just looks right. Thin with white spirit as it evaporates fast, turps takes forever. From my observations, do your washes over a couple of coats of acrylic matt varnish-touch your thinned oil laden brush on it and it tends to spread out nicely. It won't lift the paint (I've found xtracolour can though-me no likey)-I spray with acrylics, Tamiya, Gunze and xtracrylics and they are all great paints and I've never had a problem with the paint lifting. Klear also protects paint nicely, but being gloss, and therefore smooth, the oils tend to "run about" and I've found it harder to get subtle tones-works well on large assemblies, panel lines etc. The rougher nature of the matt varnish allows the oils to fill all those microscopic canyons etc, which with heavy weathering is perfect. You need to thin the oils but how much is up to you. Experiment. The pigments are very powerful, so it can be extremely thin. You can build it up in layers, or just do one coat, whatever takes your fancy. And as oils take so long to cure, you can manipulate it on the model, long after the white spirit has evaporated. Generally I'll put a thin coat of raw umber on, maybe 2, enough to stain the paint, then leave in the airing cupboard overnight, then put thin black wash over that in the morning. Play around and don't be afraid of it-it's fantastic stuff. And yes, another advantage with oils is you can blend them together even on the model to get an infinite variety of tones and colours. Normally I'd have airbrushed on some other tones, so the effect would be even more pronounced, but this is a quickie, plus it doesn't really need it IMHO. I still have to work on my pics, some arn't very sharp-will try a blue background. Just a quick suplemental to your comment on Klear/Future - if you get hold of some Tamiya Flatbase (Hannants have large 23ml bottles on special offer for 89p!) and mix it with Klear you can make your own acrylic quick-drying varnish of whatever "mattness" you want. 10:1 Klear to flatbase guves a nice sheeny matt, more flatbase gives a matter finish, less tends toward eggshell. I make mine up in batches and keep in small bottles - the very matt batch I made up over two years ago for the Bristol scout I've just finished was perfectly good after this time, just make sure you mix it thoroughly before use as the matting agent will settle out over time. It sprays beautifully without dilution, cleans up with any amonia based window cleaner, followed by a spray of water through the airbrush, as well as brushing well - although with a strongly matt finish you may get brush marks over a large area. I have a selection of five custom mixes with the proportions labeled on each small bottle. Sooo much cheaper than proprietory stuff and goes over enamels and acrylics alike with no probs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ant Posted October 17, 2008 Share Posted October 17, 2008 Throw away your acrylic washes right now, go to an art shop and buy a set of oil paints I have to agree. I started with oil washes, and have experimented with various acrylic washes, looking for a faster-drying alternative, but have come full circle and returned to oils for this sort of thing. I use humbrol enamel thinners and similar combinations of browns and black. I also apply over a satin or sometimes gloss varnish and leave it on for around 30 mins before removing excess or adding streaks with either a clean cotton bud or one slightly moistened with thinners. Works a treat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turnerdad Posted October 17, 2008 Author Share Posted October 17, 2008 Nice one Rowan, may try that. I often mix up a little gloss in with my matt if I need a slight sheen etc, but your way sounds cheaper! Especially as I just went out and bought 3 bottles of Klear after reading on ARC that it is being discontinued-which apparently, it isn't! Ant, absolutely, moisten a brush with thinners and streak away! Bloomin marvellous stuff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mentalguru Posted October 17, 2008 Share Posted October 17, 2008 OMG- TALENT! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stuart Posted October 17, 2008 Share Posted October 17, 2008 OMG- TALENT! DITTO!! The variation of the green is stunning, how did you do that? Looks like a wash, or was it pre/postshading? Great work all round, but the colour variance really stood out for me. Stuart Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Laidlaw Posted October 17, 2008 Share Posted October 17, 2008 Gurgle... How long has this taken you??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turnerdad Posted October 17, 2008 Author Share Posted October 17, 2008 Gurgle... How long has this taken you??? I've spent perhaps one full day, spread over the last 4 days. Most of the sub assemblies, wings engines etc are together. As you can see though, I'm not bothering to fill ejector pin marks where they won't be seen anyway. Nose is now on, and I'm halfway filling and dealing with that. DITTO!!The variation of the green is stunning, how did you do that? Looks like a wash, or was it pre/postshading? Great work all round, but the colour variance really stood out for me. Stuart Only an oil wash, raw umber x2, then black x1. Black spots for rivets...fine for this build, just fools the eye into believing it's busier than it actually is. Oh, and the larger black spots behind the pilots seat represent lightening holes, some of which I could see in a reference pic, they are not GIANT rivets! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mentalguru Posted October 17, 2008 Share Posted October 17, 2008 Washes, oils acrylics and stuff I NEVER use Tamiya or Gunze for detail washes- courting disaster. Lifecolour and Aeromaster type paints don't work for me either, and then theres good old enamel, behaves beautifully for me as a wash, but very aggressive and stinks to high heave. These days I am using Model Air as a very controllable and (almost) safe wash. It thins down to nothing, and luckily does not have the characteristic of wicking to the outer edge of a wash bubble like Tamiya style acrylics. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turnerdad Posted October 17, 2008 Author Share Posted October 17, 2008 Washes, oils acrylics and stuffI NEVER use Tamiya or Gunze for detail washes- courting disaster. Lifecolour and Aeromaster type paints don't work for me either, and then theres good old enamel, behaves beautifully for me as a wash, but very aggressive and stinks to high heave. These days I am using Model Air as a very controllable and (almost) safe wash. It thins down to nothing, and luckily does not have the characteristic of wicking to the outer edge of a wash bubble like Tamiya style acrylics. I'd never use acrylic paint or ink as a wash, nightmare. Oils can be controlled as they take so long to cure. Just spray with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OzH Posted October 17, 2008 Share Posted October 17, 2008 Really nice build so far, top stuff Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spitfire Posted October 17, 2008 Share Posted October 17, 2008 Remind me not to show photo's of the one I built after looking at yours, yours looks great. Cheers Den Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Laidlaw Posted October 17, 2008 Share Posted October 17, 2008 I've spent perhaps one full day, spread over the last 4 days. Most of the sub assemblies, wings engines etc are together. As you can see though, I'm not bothering to fill ejector pin marks where they won't be seen anyway. Nose is now on, and I'm halfway filling and dealing with that. In that case my building speed description has been changed from glacial to geological . Keep up with the updates please, as this - along with a few other WIPs - is proving inspirational. Thank you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keefr22 Posted October 17, 2008 Share Posted October 17, 2008 I have to agree. I started with oil washes, and have experimented with various acrylic washes, looking for a faster-drying alternative, but have come full circle and returned to oils for this sort of thing. I use humbrol enamel thinners and similar combinations of browns and black. I also apply over a satin or sometimes gloss varnish and leave it on for around 30 mins before removing excess or adding streaks with either a clean cotton bud or one slightly moistened with thinners. Works a treat. I've been trying out the new water mixeable 'Artisan' oils from Winsor & Newton. They have most of the same characteristics as traditional oils, but obviously no solvent smell & they dry almost as quickly as acrylics! So far I haven't found a catch with them ! Tremendous work so far with the build TD, very effective paintwork - looks great! Keef Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seamus Posted October 17, 2008 Share Posted October 17, 2008 That's bloody great stuff Nick, loving it Great choice of subject too; the A-20 is easily forgotten in place of the B-25 and B-26, but it's a lovely aircraft and served well I'll be watching this one with much interest Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turnerdad Posted October 18, 2008 Author Share Posted October 18, 2008 (edited) Quick update. Fixed the nose on yesterday. I superglued on the right side, and although the fit was OK, reinforced it with more accelorated superglue having keyed up the area with coarse sandpaper first. Gives the superglue something to grip to, as unlike plastic glues, it won't melt the plastic together as it's not a solvent. I then added some noseweight. The instructions call for 20g nose weight, so I araldited a couple of nuts with bolts on to the area under the cockpit where there is a large space, and another 2 in the nose which should be enough. I'll check once the wings are on but I can always add more behind the engines if I need, spreading the weight and therefore the stress. This looks like a potential tailsitter, so I generally overkill models like this, just to be sure. I then superglued the left nose side on as I was in a hurry, and the excess superglue, once hardened would act as a great filler as there was a slight gap, but better to have the gap between the 2 halves than an impossible step between the fuselage side and the nose pieces. The nose gear strut looks fairly sturdy, but I'm not using uranium so I reckon it should be fine! I cleaned up the area with 320 grit dry sandpaper, I like it as its got teeth, but they are not too sharp and destructive. One trick I've learnt to employ, is when I know I've got a lot of sanding to do, I'll scribe the panel lines that are already there, using the existing lines, deepening them, then sanding away, rescribing etc until the area is sorted. That way I don't need to "re-scribe" anything, as I'm just preserving what is already there. I once had a 1/48 Hasegawa F-18 Hornet, years ago, and glued it together, sanded all the seams away, and inevitably the panel line disappeared before it struck me that perhaps I should be preserving them!!! Never did finish it!!! I always scribe with a sharp sewing needle in a pin vice, tried "proper" scribers, too thick. With needles, you get thinness and depth, important for future washes. Having dealt with the nose area I realised ( and any of you who have this kit TAKE NOTE! ) that the panel lines over the whole model were rather shallow and worn. Perhaps it was an old mould but some panel line peetered out to nothing. So if you want to add a wash later, I'd recommend scribing everything-but as the lines are already there, just follow them with your scriber a few times, deepening them. I went over the whole body, took a couple of hours but worth it I reckon. You have to add all 18 of these vent like looking things, 9 per cowl - but beware, no spare, so take care or the carpet monster will be fed! Also, you can see the panel lines are faint. If you notice on the lower nose area. the panel lines just end...there is a raised panel that is present on the kit as a raised panel line, but it was going to disappear when the area was sanded etc, so before sanding it, I put some Tamiya masking tape over it and drew around it. Of course, I forgot the right side, so I've got 2 left side templates-after I've primed it, I'll cut these templates out and spray another couple of coats of Halfords primer, de-mask it and I should be left with 2 nice raised panels. Some more but will post this now in case of crash...thanks computer, just lost 20 mins feckin' work... Bloody hell, just spent a while writing stuff and the computer said no, and it was wiped. Oh well. Edited October 19, 2008 by turnerdad 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnonymousDFB1 Posted October 18, 2008 Share Posted October 18, 2008 Looking good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turnerdad Posted October 18, 2008 Author Share Posted October 18, 2008 Looking good. Thanks Mish, had written loads more but computer probs. Get one, lovely kit and I know you'll do it justice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnonymousDFB1 Posted October 18, 2008 Share Posted October 18, 2008 Thanks Mish, had written loads more but computer probs. Get one, lovely kit and I know you'll do it justice. Yeah bummer when that happens, when I'm writing something long I write in a test editor and save it so nothing goes wrong! I'm very tempted to get one for the D-Day GB. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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