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RAF Lightnings over Africa (profiles)


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#41 daz greenwood

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Posted 28 June 2008 - 09:12 PM

I would have thought being a French colony it would have been French forces sent to the area. Like the Belgians in Congo.

#42 keefr22

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Posted 28 June 2008 - 10:31 PM

We've been a member of NATO since 1949.


Thanks Martin - I really should have looked it up though!! :blush:

So, will you send some Drakens....??!! :D

Keef

Edited by keefr22, 28 June 2008 - 10:32 PM.


#43 hatchet

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Posted 28 June 2008 - 11:50 PM

So, will you send some Drakens....??!! :D

Feck yes!

Or Viggens, if you really wanna whiff it up!

#44 Gekko_1

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Posted 29 June 2008 - 04:55 AM

Either PR7 or PR9 - 39 Squadron for the PR9 and 100 Squadron for the PR7....I think. There may have been more than that in 78 though. Airfix are releasing the PR9 quite soon, but a PR7 would need to be scalped from a B2, which Airfix are releasing too.


Thanks Gary! :thumbsup2:

39 Squadron PR.9 it is!

Cheers

Richard.

#45 Gekko_1

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Posted 29 June 2008 - 05:18 AM

Is Denmark neutral? If so I doubt they'd get involved. Unless..........things had turned particularly ugly in Burkina faso shortly after the RAF had been forced to withdraw the Lightnings & Canberras due to the increasing build up of Soviet forces near the Fulda gap. Fearing a total breakdown of law & order (& the loss of the oilfields!), the UK & USA manage to force through a vote in the United Nations that leads to a Scandinavian peacekeeping force being deployed to the country. For logistical purposes, both Sweden & Denmark send Drakens, and having seen the efficiency of the RAF developed camo schemes, paint their aircraft the same way, whilst retaining their national markings, but with the addition of white squares containing pale blue UN markings on fuselage & wings......


In this "What if?" world of mine the United States, like Switzerland, is neutral, they have enough Oil of their own and don't tend to bother too many people. The reason for this is simple, this way I can explore other geopolitical possibilities that don't involve the USA. A perfect example of this is the spirit of closeness and cooperation that forms between the peoples of Denmark and the UK.

Though I won't go into it here, the situation post WWII between Denmark and the UK was one of continued growth both politically and economically and militarily. The United Nations however is much like what it is in the "real world"....pretty useless. With the Soviet Union forming an alliance with China and Pakistan decades before they actually did and throw-in America's neutrality you have a very rich recipe to which I can add things to this story.

Therefore the British and Danish Royal families decide on a course of action that does indeed see Danish Drakens going to Burkina Faso flying combat operations alongside RAF Lightnings, Canberras and eventually Royal Navy Buccaneers! As well as RAAF Mirage IIIC (yes IIC not IIIO!) fighter jets in the ground attack and air superiority roles and Canadian Voodoos in the Air Superiority role too! :analintruder:

Suffice to say this story is growing. AND YOU LOT ARE TO BLAME! :evil_laugh:

Oh rats, you've got me at it now.....!!

Keef


Its infectious innit! :wicked:

#46 Gekko_1

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Posted 29 June 2008 - 05:31 AM

I'm being pedantic here of course, but wouldn't it be more likely that the French would be involved, a la Djibouti or Chad?

Joseph


Well, in my "What if?" world, after independence from France in 1960, the Republic of Upper Volta not only changed its name to Burkina Faso, but began a political dialog with the UK. This lead to increased trade and British Petroleum (BP) exploration of Burkina Faso. The discovery of the size and quality of the Oil found there lead to the Soviet/Chinese intervention through Niger, then Mali and eventually bringing-in Mauritania, Morocco, Algeria and Tunisia.

Cheers

Richard.

#47 Gekko_1

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Posted 29 June 2008 - 05:41 AM

I am not a real fan of whifs, but those are greats, especialy the Rhodesian and the Burkina ones.
Just a thought, in 1978, Burkina Faso was known as Haute-Volta (In French) and this till 1984 after the coup.
Was it already known as BF in English?


Your right, in the "real world" the Republic of Upper Volta claimed independence from France in 1960 and changed its name to Burkina Faso on August 4, 1984, by President Thomas Sankara.

However, in my "What if?" world after independence from France in 1960, Upper Volta began a political dialog with the UK and re-named itself then too.

Cheers

Richard.

#48 Gekko_1

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Posted 29 June 2008 - 05:47 AM

I would have thought being a French colony it would have been French forces sent to the area. Like the Belgians in Congo.


Your right Daz, Upper Volta was a French colony up until 1960. Then in my "What if?" world, after independence from France in 1960, Upper Volta began a political dialog with the UK and re-named itself to Burkina Faso years earlier than it actaully did.

Cheers

Richard.

#49 Tiger41

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Posted 29 June 2008 - 06:02 AM

Hey Richard i am loving the RAF in Africa thing its great i love how you included the Canadian Vodoos too very cool are you going to do a paint scheme from them too what squadron are you going to get them from.

#50 Gekko_1

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Posted 29 June 2008 - 06:08 AM

With increasing airspace violations from Soviet and Chinese Fighter aircraft flying in Niger and Mali markings, the RAF had no choice but to further experiment with suitable camouflage schemes, but this time for Air Superiority schemes, as more and more often RAF Lightnings, now numbering a total of 27 jets, were being scrambled for air-to-air interceptions.

Even though RAAF Mirage IIIC fighters, Canadian Voodoos and Danish Drakens were on their way to assist, the RAF had to battle-on as best it could. Word had just come-in that Royal Navy Buccaneers were soon to make their presence felt taking on the ground attack role, easing some of the pressure from the Lightning crews who were by now flying around the clock, seven days a week!

Posted Image
Here we see Squadron Leader Simon Woodward's F.6 Lightning following his third air-to-air kill over Northern Burkina. Two of the kills were Niger MiG-19s, the other was a Mali Su-22 trying to make its way, one early dawn, to the Lightnings FOB (Forward Operating Base) in the North of Burkina Faso.

Cheers

Richard.

#51 Gekko_1

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Posted 29 June 2008 - 06:14 AM

Hey Richard i am loving the RAF in Africa thing its great i love how you included the Canadian Vodoos too very cool are you going to do a paint scheme from them too what squadron are you going to get them from.


Hi Tiger41,

glad your liking the story, I am too! :analintruder:

Yea the Canadian Voodoos will have a unique paint scheme, possibly two. But I haven't got that far yet, I'm currently working-up the RAAF Mirage profiles.

I'm afraid I know nothing about Canadian Voodoo squadrons? I'll have to do a bit of research before I can go any further with them.

Cheers

Richard.

#52 Antoine

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Posted 29 June 2008 - 07:20 AM

Your right, in the "real world" the Republic of Upper Volta claimed independence from France in 1960 and changed its name to Burkina Faso on August 4, 1984, by President Thomas Sankara.

However, in my "What if?" world after independence from France in 1960, Upper Volta began a political dialog with the UK and re-named itself then too.

Cheers

Richard.


Ok, Richard, I've missed that.

Good show anyway.
Posted Image

#53 keefr22

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Posted 29 June 2008 - 09:25 AM

Suffice to say this story is growing. AND YOU LOT ARE TO BLAME! :evil_laugh:


Good. Now then, what can we do to stir it up more??!! I'm enjoying this 'revisionist' history.....!!!! B) :P )

Its infectious innit! :wicked:


Yes. Unfortunately....!!! :D

Keef

#54 Tango India Mike

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Posted 29 June 2008 - 11:10 AM

Hi Keef,

nice to know that I've almost tempted you! :wicked: If I were you I'd build that Matchbox kit now before you get the Academy/Trumpeter kit, otherwise you'll never ever build that Matchbox kit and nobody will want to buy it off you either! :o

The reason for the wraparound scheme is that when flying at low level as soon as a jet banks to the side it is instantly spotted by the flash of light grey / blue of the underside. Also with the proliferation of surface to air missiles into the region, and prowling MiG's flown by combat experienced Russian pilots, the flying height of choice of the RAF pilots flying over Burkina Faso was 200 feet. Thus the camouflage scheme blended-in very well and the Russians hadn't, by that time, developed good ground clutter discernable radar, so the Lightnings flying that low stood a better chance of survival than at a greater height where they were vulnerable to SAM's and MiG's.

Also the role of the Lightnings in Burkina Faso was one of both air defence and ground attack. Lightnings were deemed suitable by the MOD of the time and the RAF had to make do with that decision. Phantoms and Buccaneers were needed to fulfil their NATO roles and couldn't be spared.

As for Burkina Faso decals, Zots does them:

http://www.aircraftr...zsp1/rev971.htm

Cheers

Richard. (doing his best to defend his whiffs :unsure: )



And doing a damned fine job of it too! I enjoyed that little 'back story' Richard. It could almost be a plot for a film.

I'm in Perth, by the way. Good to see a few Aussies here in Britmodeller.

Cheers,

Tim.

#55 Gekko_1

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Posted 29 June 2008 - 03:40 PM

Good. Now then, what can we do to stir it up more??!! I'm enjoying this 'revisionist' history.....!!!! B) :P )


I don't mind if you lot participate and throw some ideas into the ring. You would have all read the bits and pieces of the back story now so should have a rough idea how this story is flowing, so have a go at suggesting what else could be included. Anything from types of aircraft involved from both UK, Commonwealth and Denmark and lets not forget the aircraft from China and the Soviet Union in African camo schemes! Maybe there's some political twists and turns? Would South Africa or Rhodesia get involved? Could that bring in other African countries??

Question: What RAF type would have been available in the late 70's to early 80's for counter insurgency? In other words something that could fly slower than the fast moving jets, that could loiter above the battlefield for longer periods. A bit like the Skyraider.

Cheers

Richard.

#56 PHREAK

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Posted 29 June 2008 - 03:48 PM

Wonderful creativity...now then..

What colour schemes were the Victor tankers in?
When did the Lighnings get upgraded to FGR2s?

#57 Gekko_1

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Posted 29 June 2008 - 03:48 PM

And doing a damned fine job of it too! I enjoyed that little 'back story' Richard. It could almost be a plot for a film.

I'm in Perth, by the way. Good to see a few Aussies here in Britmodeller.

Cheers,

Tim.


Cheers Tim! And what better time to add the Aussie Mirage IIIO (or IIIC if you like, it is a whiffer after all).
Posted Image

Here's the first of the Aussie Mirage profiles, story to come.

Cheers

Richard.

#58 Richard E

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Posted 29 June 2008 - 03:53 PM

Question: What RAF type would have been available in the late 70's to early 80's for counter insurgency? In other words something that could fly slower than the fast moving jets, that could loiter above the battlefield for longer periods. A bit like the Skyraider.



Logical suggestion: Harrier GR3 or alternatively would there be some surplus Typhoons, Tempests or Sea Furies the the RAF could dust off in an emergency?

#59 Gekko_1

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Posted 29 June 2008 - 04:01 PM

Wonderful creativity...now then..

What colour schemes were the Victor tankers in?
When did the Lighnings get upgraded to FGR2s?


Victors would be in Hemp I'd say. No FGR.2's to Africa, the Lightnings are on their own. Phantoms are needed in Europe as the Soviets are behaving rather badly, and with that Russian MiG-27 being shot down near the German boarder by a Jaguar things have gotten even worse! :analintruder:

Cheers

Richard.

#60 Gekko_1

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Posted 29 June 2008 - 04:04 PM

Logical suggestion: Harrier GR3 or alternatively would there be some surplus Typhoons, Tempests or Sea Furies the the RAF could dust off in an emergency?


Harrier Gr.3.................yes, that could work!

What about Wyverns too?

Cheers

Richard.