Airfix Marketing

[thx6667]

And to echo Dave and Geoff's points, people should look at the Doctor Who kits, as they are the first all-new Airfix/Hornby products where they've had the chance to apply new ideas from scratch rather than stuff started under Humbrol.

[Mentalguru]

Nice that somebody pointed out about Revells end opening boxings, fine as a sealed unit but goes to crap as soon its opened loosing all structural strength and leaving nowhere to store the parts whilst work is in progress. Other things people have missed in tha above thread is aviation artists, they may not want to see thier work used as box art or charge such fees that the kit would be unaffordable !!!!. Couple that with political correctness and over sensitivity in Europe and the art work tends to be a tad neutral (aka nobody on the receiving end !) plus of course we have the green aspect as well where packaging and its later disposal now a major concern (thus Revells recycled simple boxes ).

As for having a dig at Airfix marketing, for goodness sake give the poor buggers a chance, Hornby only took over the name and the tools about 18mths ago, rather than buying a going concern so have had to start from fresh again sourcing new suppliers and contractors to do all of thier stuff. The key aspect has been to get the kits back into production and onto the shelves before they lost their market share for good, so the emphasis has been on that aspect to date. Obviously some contractors are not quite upto speed as yet, as the Nimrod decal sheet shows, but getting a sheet of that size and complexity done in the numbers required is not easy or cheap, however expect it to be addressed by the new team before long.

Most of the new kits we are seeing at the moment were instigated by the old Humbrol, and so Hornby should not really be judged on these but rather on the new stuff they are commisioning such as the new 24th scale Mossie.

Cheers

Geoff

So out of interest- do you know the position on companies such as Hasegawa when they use actual photo's om their box lids- particulalry for the more modern stuff

Do they have to pay royalties- umm to who- the US government for example fo say an F-4 box lid photo?

[John]

And to echo Dave and Geoff's points, people should look at the Doctor Who kits, as they are the first all-new Airfix/Hornby products where they've had the chance to apply new ideas from scratch rather than stuff started under Humbrol.

If you haven't had a chance to look at one yet, here's ours:

http://www.britmodeler.com/forums/index.ph...3&hl=tardis

There will be a build at some point in the future!

John

[thx6667]

I can't see the point you're trying to make there Ment as it doesn't seem to relate to what Geoff was saying - I'm sure Hasegawa would pay a royalty to the photogpraher or supplier for sure, if it was a DoD royalty free photo, I guess not.

If you're advicating the use of 1:1 photos for box art... I dunno, what do other feel on this?

[cdplayer]

Thanks for the really interesting replies.

Im glad the Dr who subject was brought up as it shows that when the brief allows, the marketing guys do a fantastic job. However Im sure that has in part something to do with working with the BBC ?. With the nimrod (which is a great kit by all accounts) they surely had an opportunity inject some of that production quality that Dr who fans have.

If the dull poor quality cardboard was from recycled material then they should play that up and make a point out of it rather than it just looking cheap. With these new headline hitting releases surely its a golden opportunity to show there new aspirations for the brand (see dr who box) to be invigorated.

The great thing about this hobby is that it means different things to everybody. Since getting back into it two years ago I have thought alot about why I find the hobby so compelling. To me it has a wholistic appeal that stretches from actually building the kits to subject research, as well as spending hours looking at trade stands at shows and shops. I enjoy the atmosphere and the exitement of potential projects. So for me the presentation side (more than just box art) is a intergral part of the overall hobby. Personally I enjoy looking at the crisp fresh approach of Eduard that seems to effectively represent the quality of the kit inside. Its my first point of contact with a model when "cold browsing" and for me the sence of TOTAL QUALITY in a product is very seductive and will tip my decision. Maybe Im just a sucker for marketing ??

chris

[Eric2020]

Marketing wise Airfix/Hornby are I think realy good, as they came from the modeltrain world. In that field they are number 1 or very close. That is an position won by very good and keen eyes in marketing strategy.

[thx6667]

As a quick question, how many of the participants in this thread have a copy of the 2008 Airfix catalogue?

[John]

As a quick question, how many of the participants in this thread have a copy of the 2008 Airfix catalogue?

Me, bought from my LMS as soon as it was in the door. It's a fantastic piece of work.

John

[Eric2020]

As a quick question, how many of the participants in this thread have a copy of the 2008 Airfix catalogue?

I do not have one, but I know from my store somene was picking up old catalogs. I'm not buying them anymore as I do not know what to do with them. now we have internet every kit item is found in no time. But I still feel quilty of throwing away my ESCI catalog I used to have.

Royalties have to be paid for everything, either paintings or pictures unles the firm say Airfix took them themselves. One thing found on the boxes of Italeri is the "official" logo. I did hear that the American toy industry is having an fight as well in getting rights to produce toys looking like an F-teen or so.

[cdplayer]

From the posts it sounds like airfix under the new ownership of hornby may be in the process of changing things, and if thats the case Fantastic !!

I will check out the catalogue next time Im in town

chris

[denstore]

But seriously, think about it. in this envirnomentally friendly age of reducing packaging and other consumables such as plastic carrier bags, this is a conversation about wanting a prettier box - 95% of which will end up in landfill!

If we should talk about the environment, I think that the box is less hazardous than the content.....

And sooner or later, they all end up as landfill.

And when we are talking about the content.....

I can see the reasoning in that the content is more important than the box. OK, I buy the logic. But the problem is that Hasegawa, Tamiya and Revell have better boxes AND better content a lot of the time. Sure, the Nimrod looks fine, but just to inform you people, Airfix isn´t affordable everywhere. At the moment the Nimrod costs about £55 here in Sweden, and that isn´t cheap however you look at it. Sure, I can import it myself, but I can import Tamiya and Hasegawa as well, and I can stroll down to the local store, and buy the Revell Grief, Blohm & Voss 222 or something like, at roughly half the price. With nicer boxart. And as good detail.

What bugs me when it comes to Airfix, is that people tend to be blind about problems they wouldn´t accept in other brands. Here´s some I´ve picked up in reviews so far:

(Fotios Rouch, Cybermodeler accepts some things that never would be accepted on a Big T kit)

"The surface detail is great and I noticed no sink marks on the plastic except maybe on the upper wing parts over the landing gear bays and even then they are barely noticeable."

"The decals look very complete with all kinds of stencils and warnings but the solid big single color areas like the blue and red/pink of the national insignia might not appeal to some. I have three Nimrod decal sets from Model Alliance on order and that should rectify my concerns."

(Brett Green, Hyperscale find the positive side of having to scratchbuild the interior)

"The lack of interior detail will be viewed as a shortcoming by some, but others will be pleased to be free of the extra time involved with fitting out a cockpit and cabin that will never be seen. "

Not that the reviewers are wrong, but would they write the same if it said Hasegawa or Tamiya on the boxes? I really don´t think so.

Think about the talk in the HS forum if it would have been kits by Hobbyboss or Trumpeter? Asbest wouldn´t have helped keep the flames down. Virtual bonfire!

And I truly believe that the Nimrod might be the best Airfix have done so far, and hopefully a sign of what we will see in the future. But still, I sometimes find the glorification of Airfix products to be a little bit too much. When I open my Lightning boxes, and see the sinkmarks infront of the canopy, it always makes me put them back. And not because I can´t fix them, but because it irritates me that they are there, in a place where everybody have their attention.

But of course, this is just my thoughts and beliefs.

[AnonymousA667]

From the posts it sounds like airfix under the new ownership of hornby may be in the process of changing things, and if thats the case Fantastic !!

They most certainly are, but as Geoff has pointed out, given the time scale we need to give them the chance to show that they are making a difference. I have a degree of sympathy with your view about box art. I think if they wanted to make a real splash they should consider using the same style as the Club Edition Spitfire. Simple but very appealing.

peebeep

[thx6667]

Not that the reviewers are wrong, but would they write the same if it said Hasegawa or Tamiya on the boxes?

But neither Tamiya or Hasegawa have made a Nimrod, so this comparing real kits to imaginary one tends to be a bit meaningless really.

Edited March 11, 2008 by Jonathan Mock

[miduppergunner]

It is difficult for me to empathise with some of this. I like the Dynavector kits - in comparison with the injection kits they are crude however and the "boxing" is almost amateur. But to me building vac form is much more interesting and challenging and about as near as I can get to "scratch" building without actually doing so. Using someone else's "moldings" is about the same as building model ships using simply a fibre glass hull that has been purchased. It is not really economic to produce one set of moldings. Consequently the "appeal" of the boxing is not important. It is soon discarded. Whilst I cannot claim to be a connoisseur are not Hasegawa and Tamiya kits overall more expensive than most - but in return provide overall better quality? Revell are now becoming the exception but probably produce greater numbers? I am not taken by Revell Box art however.

In short attractive box art will no doubt turn on the "casual" modeller - or the first timer, but overall I am not sure that the regular modeller will be particularly influenced. I think some of the bias - if it be that - in favour of Airfix is because Airfix has perhaps been regarded as - in a variety of ways -the underdog. There are several points made above to which I would ask "why" - for example - "play up the recycling of the box material (if it be that). I would not like us to degenerate into the stupidity of some advertising ploys - like years ago cars were marketed with a "go faster stripe" - how on earth could a stick on stripe make the thing go any more quickly?? Leather covered gear knobs were given more credence than the mechanics. There perhaps it was aimed at a fairly unthinking group of people. Most modellers are more sophisticated.

[desmojen]

Most of the new kits we are seeing at the moment were instigated by the old Humbrol, and so Hornby should not really be judged on these but rather on the new stuff they are commisioning such as the new 24th scale Mossie.

Cheers

Geoff

Fair point, but how hard is it to order a decent box? Do the train sets come in wishy washy boxes?

Don't get me wrong, I'm more interested in the contents myself but I am totally sympathetic to Chris' original point. A Tamiya kit is a quality product right the way through from the box art to the way it's packaged to the kit itself, it's a complete product.

Oh, and I'd love to reduce my carbon footprint and recycle all the boxes and empty sprues................if my council were interested in taking them in the recycling box! :w***:

Jen.

[Richard M]

I like the current new box art which is showing up, the TSR2, Lifeboat, Nimrod, strike me as being evocative and dynamic. I personally don't like made up models on box art. I also like the new boxes that are being used on the Lifeboat, Nimrod and Spitfires, very sturdy and strong and handy for storing the kit bits and pieces in while working on it. Personally I can't stand the end openers, crap for storage.

Be interesting to see the new 1/48 TSR2 box art, hopefully they will do a Club Special Edition print in the same way as for the 1/72 TSR2 - that was good marketing!

At the end of the day I'd rather have a decent kit than gee whizz boxart e.g Aeroclub style kits.

My 2p worth, as ever your mileage may vary. (I have the downloadable catalogue BTW).

Best

Rich

[denstore]

But neither Tamiya or Hasegawa have made a Nimrod, so this comparing real kits to imaginary one tends to be a bit meaningless really.

Besides, I thought this hread was about box art and marketing.

I didn´t bring the insides into the discussion, you did.

But personally speaking I'd rather resources be spent on the plastic and decals rather than the finer degrees of the packaging.

And no, Tamiya and Hasegawa hasn´t made Nimrods, but are you then saying that we can´t compare kitmaking, just because the subjects arn´t the same? Really, that´s just proves my point. You where the one to steer the discussion towards the contents, and now you are saying that we should keep to boxart, just because the subject are not the same? Talk about biased....

[tedtaylor]

Hi everyone. excuse me if this is the wrong area to post this so moderators feel free to move !!

In MY opinion airfix is missing out on potential sales due to old fashioned, poor quality, packaging.

. Micheal Turner and Robert Taylor are amongst the best in the world. What great advertising for an aviation artist.

Rant over, Im getting off the soap box

chris

Chris, I don't want to dampen your spirits but, the two artists you mention don't need any advertising and they are not box top artists just have a look at their web sites to see that and note the prices they charge.

The fees they would want Hornby could not justify to the accountants.

The two guys would not be interested in that sort of work as they are too busy with exhibitions and commisions of their own.

Even great artists such as Roy Huxley, who I know personaly, couldn't be tempted by that sort of work any more

so although I agree about the state of Airfix art, and it is awful, thats what you get at those prices that Hornby can afford.

Ted

[dad's lad]

[Ratch]

When I was a boy, artwork was everything. I'd only buy the Matchbox/Airfix/Aurora/Whoever kit with the best picture on it Blasting guns, exploding bombs, dynamic poses got my juices flowing Move on thirty-odd years and I had t become more selective in my purchases (to prevent the stash becoming unmanageable) and decided to build to a theme. This has meant that I now buy the subjects that fit in to that theme regardless of the artwork That said, I can still be inspired by good box-art but good is a subjective word, my good will be something totally different to someone else's

Structurally I much prefer Airfix's tray & lid boxes to Revell's flimsy end-opening collapsibles and every time I hear Airfix being compared to Tamiya or Hasegawa its done with an air of snobbery well I'm sorry, but for the main part they don't offer products of subjects I want, in scales that I want, or at prices I'm prepared to pay :shithappens:

[cdplayer]

Hi Ted

You are right. Im under no illusion that airfix or any other model company could afford Micheal Turner or Robert Taylor, nor do they in turn need any advertising !!. It was probably wrong of me to mention those two names specifically. However there ARE many commercial illustrators whose work would suit box art. Maybe airfix should have an open competition to illustrate one of the up and coming releases ?? Its an idea. As an proffesional illustrator myself (albeit an architectural one) I would enter !!!!!! They would get a great choice of images and the choosen illustrator would get fantasic exposure.

I agree that photos of finished models is not my cup of tea. To me it ruins the mystic.

[thx6667]

And no, Tamiya and Hasegawa hasn´t made Nimrods, but are you then saying that we can´t compare kitmaking, just because the subjects arn´t the same? Really, that´s just proves my point. You where the one to steer the discussion towards the contents, and now you are saying that we should keep to boxart, just because the subject are not the same?

Den, I was not trying to "steer the dicussion towards the contents", I was making the point that I personally would rather see resources put into the plastic and decals rather than repackaging. Likewise with the comments about marketing, I've tried to point out the work that the marketing people are doing.

Talk about biased....

Great contribution there Den, any more in the bag or are you done now?

[Gary West]

Yep, gonna join you.....you can see where this will lead to already!

[AnonymousDFB1]

Yep, gonna join you.....you can see where this will lead to already!

Yep that big X

[thx6667]

What bugs me when it comes to Airfix, is that people tend to be blind about problems they wouldn´t accept in other brands. Here´s some I´ve picked up in reviews so far:

But those exmaples were hardly "blind" were they? Every kit company has its yay and nay lobby, that's never going to change.

Have a trawl through the Nimrod posts here on BM, I don't think you'll find many "blind" modellers here, the difference is that they highlight problems and then set about tackling them.