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Introduction This thread was started intending to unite those interested in building the Fiat 806 based on thorough research and photogrammetry. See also the great Fiat 806 Gangshow build album. In the current thread there will be (at least I hope people will post) extensive research on the original car, photographs, drawings, literature and archives. Beside that the thread will feature scratchbuilding progress based on the findings. Perhaps in the future there could be exchanges of resin molded scratch parts, just like Vontrips kindly did with the tyres (for example: body panels / grille?) Index To start off I have gone through all of the Gangshow topic and I indexed all knowhow. Best way to use it: click a link, go back and click the next link etc. Or open the links in a separate browser tab. Each link represents one post only, so it's better to only read that post, come back to the index and click the next link. The index was created having in mind those who are about to work on a certain subject, such as the steering wheel. For the index, see end of this opening post. Visual reference material First a legal disclaimer. All images are used for educational and referential purposes. Copyrights lie with the copyright holders. Centro Storico Fiat is probably the original copyright holder of many of these images. Centro Storico's website can be accessed here and here. It has a Facebook page here. Be sure to have a look at their great collection of photos of classic Fiat and Lancia cars. Centro Storico also has frequent Twitter updates featuring photographs, see here. Drawing 6 was found here. All copyrights of the photos / screenshots 10-19 lie with Cinecitta Luce. My presentation of the low-definition photos on this forum is just for reference and educational purposes, for the purpose of a hobby. I do not have a corporate license for the use of these images. If at any point in time Cinecitta Luce wishes these pictures removed I will remove them upon first request. The pictures are not to be reproduced on another website or another written work. Please, all, respect Cinecitta Luce's copyrights. Their website is to be found here. All rights to Photo 9 lie with Fotogeca Gilardi, see here. There you can inquire about the cost to purchase a license of a full-scale version of Photo 9. Some pictures of the Fiat 806, such as Photo 1, Photo 2, Drawing 2, Drawing 3 and Drawing 6, are larger than shown here. To enlarge, right-click on the picture and choose 'open new tab', then click on the picture on the new tab. Photo 1A Photo 1AA Photo 1B Photo 2 Photo 3 Photo 4A Photo 4B Photo 5 Photo 6A Photo 6B Photo 7A Photo 7B Photo 7C Photo 7D Photo 7E Photo 7F Photo 8A Photo 8B Photo 9 Photo 10 Photo 11 Photo 12 Photo 13 Photo 14 Photo 15 Photo 16 Photo 17 Photo 18 Photo 19 Photo 20 Photo 21 Photo 22 Photo 23A Photo 23B Photo 23C Photo 24 Photo 25 Photo 26 Photo 27 Photo 28A Photo 28B Documentary These are the contents of the documentary (references in this overview), insofar most relevant for the Fiat 806. A full transcription, with correct chronology, is to be found here. 01:01 - Fiat 806 (#15), front view, being cleaned. Grille shape, car width, front wheel camber, steer linkage, tyre width, manual crank opening position, suspension position, metal wind shield are shown. No number '15' visible on radiator or bonnets. No dent (compare photo 9) visible. There is symmetry in bonnet bulges. 03:14 - Fiat 806 (#15) is pushed toward the start line, for the start of heat 2. All numbers '15' have been applied. There is no dent in the radiator housing. Moments after this video was filmed, Photos 4 and 10 were taken. 03:22 - Fiat 806 (#15) is seen from the left, close-up. The 'rear wheel louvres', exhaust pipe-to-body connector, steering wheel, seat (with rain cover?), gas cap, left hand body lining, glass window, mechanical windshield and rear number '15' are seen up close. 05:12 - Close-up of the Fiat 806 (#15). The left bonnet and part of the '5' is seen. There is a rain cover over the glass window. 05:15 - Low side view of the Fiat 806 (#15). This is the lowest view we have of this car to date, which makes it very valuable to assess the height of the wheels in comparison to that of the body. This is final proof that the body was indeed significantly lower than Drawing 1 and the kit would imply. Left to the Fiat, there is the Bugatti 35C (#24) driven by Aymo Maggi. Only one umbrella is up so there can't be too much rain at this point. 05:22 - The start of the final heat. The Fiat 806 is gloriously captured spurting away. Two days ago someone said in this thread 'what I'd give to have seen this care race'... probably this is as close as we're going to get at that. It is great to be able to witness this wonderful day in September 1927. For our research this scene is relevant mainly because Bordino steers his car a bit, so that it is seen from different views - in ONE camera shot. That is very fortunate. 05:41 - At Curva Sud, the Fiat 806 is seen in first position. 07:07 - Fiat 806 is seen up-close, from the right side this time. The glass screen is now very well seen. Also the tyre pattern, for example. The metallic windscreen is seen as well. Drawing 1A Drawing 1B Drawing 2A Drawing 2B Drawing 2C (Next is the straightened, rotated and rescaled version; one of the original versions can be found here and the Gimp file of the upgrade can be found here) Amended Drawing 2 v9. The Gimp file can be downloaded here. Drawing 2D To use this Drawing 2C for scratchbuilding (or comparing) the frame, see here. Drawing 2E This Drawing is only to be used for researching and checking details that are not to be found on Drawing 2A, Drawing 2B or Drawing 2C. I strongly advise against using it for measurement purposes because it consists of several photos of the blueprint 'glued' together. Drawing 3 Drawing 4 Drawing 5 Drawing 6 Drawing 7 Drawing 8 Engine Drawing 1 Engine Drawing 2 Engine Drawing 3 Engine Drawing 4 Engine Drawing 5 Engine Drawing 6 Photogrammetry 1 Photogrammetry 2 Photogrammetry 3 Photogrammetry 4 Photogrammetry 5 Photogrammetry 6 Model 1: Model 2 The hereunder index is updated up to & including: November 10 2016 BODY AND GRILLE - Hood hinges, see also here and here and here and here and here - Replacing the louvres, see also here and here and here and here and here and here and here and here and here - Grille color, see also here - Body color, see also here CAR GENERAL SHAPE RESEARCH, INCLUDING PHOTOGRAMMETRY - General body shape photogrammetry, see also here and here and here and here and here and here and here and here and here and here and here and here and here and here and here and here - Comparing two photos, see also here - Body should be lower (and other changes), see also here and here and here and here and here and here and here and here and here and here and here and here and here and here - Grille changes, see also here and here and here and here and here and here and here and here and here and here and here and here and here and here and here and here and here and here and here and here and here and here and here and here and here and here - Cutaway drawing accuracy, see also here and here[ and here CHASSIS, FRAME AND SUSPENSION - Amending springs, see also here and here and here - Turning dampers, see also here and here GENERAL KNOWLEDGE ON CAR AND TECHNIQUES - Colors, steering wheel, windscreen - Engine, radiator, grille - Color of rails, see also here - Photos of pre-war race cars details, see also here - Article about vintage car paint, wired wheels et cetera - 3D-printing, see also here and here - Upcoming 1:1 Fiat 806 replica? ENGINE - General engine corrections, steering idler arm correction, see also here and here and here - New filler cap - Engine sump, see also here - Casting engine covers, see also here and here - Spark plugs, see also here and here and here and here - Plug leads and wiring, see also here and here and here and here and here and here and here and here - Fill certain gaps?, see also here and here and here and here - Correcting cylinder head ends - Correcting PVC tubes, see also here - Collector tubes?, see also here and here and here and here and here - Correct stand 121D - Valve springs EXHAUST - Exhaust issues - Color of exhaust INTERIOR, EXCEPT STEERING WHEEL - Gear shift - Instrument panel: turning gauge bezels, see also here and here and here STEERING WHEEL - Steering wheel boss replacement, 12 or 16 holes in wheel, see also here and here and here and here and here and here and here and here and here and here and here and here - New spokes - Transparent part, see also here and here and here and here and here and here and here and here and here and here and here and here and here - General steering wheel amendments, see also here Ignition timing lever and brodie knob, see also here and here and here and here and here and here - Steering column, see also here WHEELS AND DRUM BRAKES - Spoke count, see also here and here and here - Respoking and nipples, see also here and here and here and here and here and here and here and here and here - Spoke color - Drum size photogrammetry - Comparison Protar and Italeri wheels - Color of drum brakes and wheels - Creating a mold - Newly cast tyre, see also here and here - Replacement drums, see also here and here and here and here and here - Adding cooling vents to drums and here Things to do 1. Visit Centro Storico Fiat (after approval, hopefully January 2017). Roy. 2. Check with Fiat Powertrain Technologies regarding blueprints (reminder). Roy 3. Check with Cinecitta Luce regarding Photos 10 and 11 and possibly survived original film reel (reminder). Roy. 4. Check with Museum of Speed, Monza (reminder). Roy. 5. Try to get a flatter version of Photo 21 (Olivier could you follow this up, or could you tell me the contact that sent you?) Olivier. 6. Try to get a larger version of Photo 22 Olivier. 7. Ask if there is more to Literature Excerpt 1 (A. Tito Anselmi's book) which I'm almost 100% sure there is. Try to get the remainder Olivier. 8. Ask who is the author of Literature Excerpt 2 and if there were no more than two pages. If there is more, to try getting the remainder Olivier. 9. Contact author of Literature Excerpt 1, asking him about sources. Yet unknown. 10. Contact author of Literature Excerpt 2, asking him about his sources. Yet unknown. 11. Please feel free to add to this list (=tell me) the loose ends you guys are waiting for. All.
I seem to have been sucked over the spoke event horizon. Spoked wheels have recently been covered in both the Fiat 806 and Mefistofele threads that are currently running. The conversation touched on the potential for computer modelling tools to depict spoked wheels. I opined on how this might be done. I then thought I ought at least to demonstrate the approach rather than pontificate some impractical theoretical method I ought at least try it. Rather than hijack the thread further, I thought I had better create a mini WIP just on this small aspect. It's probably more of a how to really. The goal is to start from either a drawing and generate a representative (but not necessarily completely accurate) model that could be used as a basis for 3-D printing. The lack of precision is due to i) me being a bit slap-dash; and ii) I wanted to have a minimum thickness that stood a chance of being printed. The output will be a file that contains all the components and consolidated models that can be used in a number of combinations and potentially could be used as the basis for any spoked wheel. The only step I don't plan to do is add the embossed detail, I am not particularly skilled at this and I want to get on with other things. This will be relatively short, I hope but I will submit in installments. I will use a free surface modelling tool called Blender. The steps are: model the wheel and hub; model an architypal spoke; generate sets of spokes; merge all the components into a printable object. I will post the completed model at the end for information and should anyone wish to use it or modify it for personal projects. Wheel and hub models. The wheel I want to represent is that for the FIAT Mefistofele. Sources are: many pictures on the web, though few which cover the full circumference. There is also a copy of the line drawing from the kit instructions and of course the wheel in the kit.The wheels have 70 spokes. On the front wheels, there are 6 sets. The outermost is clockwise (hub to rim) with 14 spokes. then anticlock with 14 spokes. Both sets attach to the outer edge of the rim. Mid-rim there are two sets of 7 spokes that attach to the inner face of the hub. Inboard, the last 2 14-spoke rims that connect to the inner hub. So there are 28 spokes connected to the outer edge of the hub and 42 to the inner edge. I chose to model the rim and hub two different ways. The first was drawn using the cross-section for the rear wheel using the drawing from the kit instructions. The result is shown below: To generate the model, the image is loaded into a class of object called an "empty" object. That can then be aligned with the cardinal axes, scalled appropriately. If you are new to Blender the interface is a bit obscure but these are fairly straightforward once you get the hang of it. Having aligned and scaled the picture. I added a circle (renamed it - eventually) and entered edit mode. Generating a shape is then a case of align the diameter with the drawing and successively extruding (E), scaling (S) until the required profile is generated. The wheel is modelled as a single object with 3 separate meshes comprising the tyre, rim and hub. This allows various combinations of the 3 components to be used. Once familiar with the interface this type of object takes about 30mins to 1hour to complete, so fairly quick once set up. Counting the spokes took as much again!